Gymnastics of the fingerboard

[lwl]

The thread on Erlkonig makes me wonder the following:

How many of you derive a substantial amount of your violinistic pleasure from execution of technical pyrotechnics? (It doesn't have to be on the Paganini level, or even classical -- plenty of fast and furious stuff for even beginners, plus no shortage of fiddle music, certainly.)

Milstein wrote that when he was young, his principal pleasure was to play as fast as possible.

My teacher tells me that she's noticed that I seem to have a certain attraction to works she deems Olympics of the Fingerboard. While I like to think I vary my musical content across a variety of styles, I have to admit that certain types of virtuosic pyrotechnics are pure unadulterated fun.

[Cedar]

Gotta agree that pulling off a zippy little run is great fun, especially in orchestral pieces. Part of it is just the endorphin high that comes from any vigorous physical activity.

For me though its not a big part of playing. I'm more into schmaltzy, romantic stuff.

Some of this is age related. Ten years ago I couldn't get enough of riding my motorcycle, this year I didn't take it out of the garage.

[jake]

Although I do like to play things that are challenging to bolster my ego, I often refuse to play pieces that are merely difficult and not musical.

[Mu0n]

These days, I'm playing the 3rd movement of Seitz' student concerto #1, the one that has slides, left hand pizzicatto (always on open strings) and plenty of harmonics. You can very easily slip into goofy play mode with this piece, and you bet that's how I play it when I'm not focused and droning toward the end of my practice time..

[Stephen Fine]

On Milstein's playing fast:

When my violin teacher was just a young snob at music school, she and her whole class walked out of a Milstein solo Bach concert due to his playing the selections so quickly. She regrets it now, but still thinks he plays them to quickly.

[lwl]

Milstein's tempos are always interesting. The young Milstein is almost Heifetz-like in his very fast tempos -- the two are startlingly similar in some ways in their youth. Later on Milstein seems to become much more expansive. Maturity, I guess.

[Strad500]

I like playing the "fast and furious," mostly because of the sense of accomplishment; it's an ego thing. But when it comes to listening, I prefer slow and musical. That's how I like to listen to the violin.

[staylor]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lymond:

On Milstein's playing fast:

When my violin teacher was just a young snob at music school, she and her whole class walked out of a Milstein solo Bach concert due to his playing the selections so quickly. She regrets it now, but still thinks he plays them to quickly.

---

Wasn't it enough just to stay inside and make funny faces at each other?

[Hank Schutz]

Speed is definitely NOT my fix. I get the biggest high when playing quartets and we reach one of those moments when everyone is perfectly "in the groove" insofar as tune, tempo and musical vision. Nothing like it to my mind.

HS

[MrWoof]

One of the hardest things to do is to play a slow piece well. It is one thing to execute a series of runs well, however it takes a lot more finesse to make a whole note in a slow movement intense with emotion and anticipation.

Regardless of how quick or slow a piece is the object is to make music. I would not want to play slowly or rapidly nor listen to someone do so in an unmusical manner.

Making music is more than playing notes well. Making music means touching another profoundly through the artistic use of sound as a medium.

Regards,

Don Crandall

[oldgeezer]

Of course it’s a joy to get those left hand fingers flying and the bow too. Take a fiddle tune at breakneck speed while ornamenting the snot out of it with lots of extra notes. But I also know that playing too fast is a sign of not very good fiddler. It applies to classical too when the tempo is way off from any reasonable interpretation.

There are lots of fun things that call for speed and gymnastics. Why not have fun fun fun playing at the edge when you are playing for your own amusement? You don’t have to always play to please an audience.

[Yankee Fiddler]

I'm with Cedar. I really love the "schmaltzy romantic" music too. I enjoy the slower things that allow lots of expression over trying to run someone over with a blast of notes. Fast is fun sometimes, but overall, I enjoy the slower, prettier things.

Yankee Fiddler

[ckrupsha]

I think I get most of my kicks by using second and fourth position whenever useful in orchestral works, and wathchng the rest of the section engage in gymanstics to play the same thing.

The rest of my section happens to be under 20, and my reflexes are not as good as theirs, so I cannot play as fast as most of them on the first few readings. BUT, I take tremendous satisfaction in being a more mature and well rounded player in that I can effortlessly use ALL the positions when required, on sight.

I wish I hadn't stopped playing for ten years, maybe I wouldn't have the "issue" with playing at high velocity now. But as a result I work to refine my strengths and I think I play better musically as a result.

[Peter D]

Let me finish the Milstein story: The interviewer then asked, "When did you stop playing too fast?"

Milstein replied, "Why don't you ask me, when did I grow up...and become a human being. Some people never grow up. I was lucky, I did."

[Yankee Fiddler]

Pete D., I love that story.

Yankee Fiddler

[Andrew Victor]

Lydia,

I like your choice of the word "gymnastics." I've long used the analogy between the training regimens one hears about for those amazing young Olympic stars (gymnasts) and for the hands of violinists.

I think it is really neat that so many of those really great-sounding violin fireworks really "fall under the hand." Then there is the stuff that is hard to play at half the speed (whether late 20th century music, or J.S. Bach) because of either the wya it is "not violinistic" or modulates so much.

I look at "playing too fast" as something completely different. Bell, for example seems to be an incredible player, who would please me twice as much if he played half of his stuff about half as fast. To my ears he takes much of the stuff just beyond a speed at which it ceases to be music. (Maybe my brain is just too slow - or is it the speed of sound in my head?)

I grew up trying to play everything too fast, (even at the cost of playing it right) at least now as I slow down naturally I may still have few years left before I have to "cry uncle."

Andy

[staylor]

I've often wondered if there are people who hear things played fast in the way that I hear it only when played slower. Or the other way round.

I think the answer is that it is the same for everyone, more or less, though some people can see many more details in a shorter time. But the speed is connected to something in nature, isn't it? Andy?

(something like 78.3 to a second? Or something?)

[HuangKaiVun]

I hear things slow the way you say, staylor. The need for speed is INNATE, though training does "slow things down".

There's a big difference between playing fast for the sake of playing fast and playing fast for the purpose of bringing out the MUSIC.

A guy like Heifetz falls into the latter category.

[lwl]

Heifetz is interesting because he got faster and less emotional as he got older. Some of his early recordings are really molten, and he's backed off to a much cooler (but faster) interpretation by the time a few decades more have passed.