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Has violin composition reached its peak?


Granny
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I seriously feel there's yet to be one composer who composed tracendental music for the violin.For example, pianist are blessed with Chopin and Liszt which technique is not merely the case here but has some great depth of beauty, inovations in harmony and structure.

Whats your opinion anyway?

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What I meant is a composer that almost solely composed for the violin, Paganini is the closest to this description but I don't think his music is tracendental.

Any true music lover will know Sarasate, Kreisler, Ernst (gasp!) and Paganini are 2nd rate composers.There has yet to be one genius for the violin.

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The golden age of great violinists/composers was the age of Corelli, Tartini, Vivaldi, Veracini, Leclair. They were the top composers of their time, setting new standards for music, and at the same time, the top violinists. It never repeated again, and obviously will not.

However, they did not introduced great changes if compared to people like Bach, Rameau, Telemann, Handel, Haydn, etc. It`s common to say that, in order to be a great composer, one should conceive it in a harmonic instrument( piano, organ, etc.), not in a melodic one.

It makes sense. Others may say that Bach, Beethoven, Mozart etc. played the violin also... ok, but they concentrated much more on keyboard instruments.

By the way, great topic.

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And once again... gasp!

Second-rate composers?! Any true music lover?!

*Maybe* they weren't as "good" (whatever that means) as Beethoven and Brahms, but neither were Chopin and Liszt! (IMveryHO)

I like to think of myself as a music lover (why else would I be doing what I'm doing?) and when I play something by Sarasate or Paganini, I don't think that I'm playing 2nd rate music.

So once again, I respectfully disagree, and I ask: What is it about compositions by S,P,E,W,K, etc. that (for you) make them 2nd rate?

-Jesse smile.gif

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Enescu?

I haven't heard Ernst for a while (don't worry Rosand CD's, I'm coming home soon!). As for Sarasate, Kreisler, and Paganini, I don't think they're Bach calibre or anything, though I don't like to call them 2nd rate. Sarasate's "Introduction and Tarantella," for example, isn't devoid of musical or compositional value. Notice the recurring chromatic figure (slow or fast) and some of the rhythmic motives (other than the fast notes in the Tarantella). Paganini and Wieniawski's concertos still get played. I'm not sure about Goldmark, but Conus was a violinist-composer. I played some of his concerto for a violinist at an audition, and to my utter disbelief he had heard of a Conus symphony but not the concerto in decades of the professional life. I'm mesmerized just thinking about Ysaye's "Reve d'enfant."

Kreisler wrote a concerto, a string quartet, and some great vignettes. He managed to fool all but the highest circles of the Western classical music world with his "Classical Manuscripts."

I agree that the golden age for violinist-composers was around Corelli's day. I'm also not completely sure what good music is anymore. Chopin is a great example of a pianist-composer, though I think his stuff is usually rated higher than Joachim's or Sarasate's. If Chopin was a better composer, it's for the reason Locatelli gave.

Liszt was an all-around bad-*** . He was the Paganini of the piano, he was an innovative composer, and he taught for free! The "Tristan" chord was supposedly Liszt's invention, and Liszt developed thematic transformation and invented the tone poem. Has anyone heard Les Preludes?

-Aman

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quote:

Originally posted by Granny:

I seriously feel there's yet to be one composer who composed tracendental music for the violin.For example, pianist are blessed with Chopin and Liszt which technique is not merely the case here but has some great depth of beauty, inovations in harmony and structure.

Whats your opinion anyway?

Just listen to the 2nd movement of the Beethoven violin concerto and your quams will be gone!

roman

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Gasp! I can think of dozens of composers who have composed amazing, even "trancendental" music for the violin!

Are you talking about only violinist-composers? If so, what about Sarasate? Kreisler? Ernst? Wieniawski? Paganini? and a dozen others...

I guess I disagree, but perhaps I'm biased smile.gif

-Jesse

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This entire question is ridiculous. Example: love the Bach "Chaconne" for what it is, comparing it to the Mendelsohn concerto it crazy. They are both wonderful works of art.

Remember when you listen to any composition you are listening to the ideas and emotions of three people. The composer's structure and intention, the performer's interpertation, and your own expectations.

Just listen, and go where the music will take you. Let it be what it is. In the process perhaps you will find yourself transformed. Like charity, it should begin at home.

Regards,

DC

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quote:

Originally posted by Granny:

What I meant is a composer that almost solely composed for the violin

Why on Earth does THAT matter? There are lots of absolutely splendid, "transcendental" (whatever that means) compositions written for the violin by composers who happened to be talented enough to write for a host of instruments. Why not ask about the transcendental violin works of one-armed, one-eyed jaw harp players from Tasmania? It's an equally valid question. Are you implying that the Bruch, Mendelssohn, Bach, Beethoven, etc works are less valid as compositions because their creators could write for more than one instrument?

Transcendental, my @ss.

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