As you learn and increase in quality of making, what do you do with your first instruments?

[Will Turner]

I feel that I've just hit the point of my making where I actually wouldn't feel bad about selling the instruments from this point forward.    The issue is that it took a number of instruments to get to this point.    At the time, I thought each was good, but looking at those starters I feel embarrassed. 

My spouse says they look and sound fine to her and to sell them cheap or donate to a school.    However, I'm also looking at trying to build recognition at some point and would not want the earliest instruments to be an indication of my improving efforts.

The other thought I had was, disassemble them and perhaps salvage what is possibly re-usable and burn the rest of the material.    Or if the ribs garland and back plate were decent enough to toss only the top plate into the fire.

How did you handle your earliest builds back at the beginning?   Perhaps I'm being too "perfectionist" oriented and the donation or cheap starter instrument approach would be acceptable?

Likely in another 10 years, I'd want to toss my existing efforts into the fire as well, so at some point I need to just move forward.

 

[Don Noon]

It depends how bad your first ones are.  I held onto my first one (not counting the goofy snakefiddle, which I never intended to sell anyway) for a while, but ended up selling it to someone cheap.  It sounded good, and wasn't too crude or bizarre.

[Brian in Texas]

There's a guy that I'm friends with online that's currently finishing his final year at the Chicago school, and he related a story to me. Apparently one of his instructors once said that if they had their first thirty instruments all in one place, that they'd light them all on fire. I heard that story when I was working on #1, hoping against hope that it would turn out better than average for my first. Talk about a reality check. But yeah, that's the kind of self criticism that this field creates.

I don't know how things will pan out for me. But I can say with 100% confidence that violin #1 will never belong to anyone but me. It's too ugly to go out into the world. I'm going to hang onto it to remind me of where I started. When I visited with Mike Sheriff a while back, he said that while certain details were lacking, my first violin looked better overall than his first. And to drive the point home, he pulled his very first violin off a shelf, blew the dust off of it, and compared the two. His instruments sell for five figures now, and since his #1 is still in his possession, that just reinforced my own decision to never let mine go.

My second one is a viola I'm currently making for a friend. It won't be judged as harshly by him as it will be by me. But it'll also be judged by my teacher, so I'm motivated to do well in his eyes, too.

As for when I'll feel comfortable donating, much less selling to strangers, who knows.

[Dr. Mark]

I have no pride.  There are six of my first instruments that I don't still have, only two of which I personally destroyed.  My very first violin I ruined because I believed the linseed-saturation method, and because it was my first (and only) use of home-made Michelman varnish, which I believe I made correctly but didn't like.  It was really the linseed oil though.  On the other hand, I've always thought the shape of the body was the best I've ever done.  The other I destroyed because the plate edges were too thin, but also the varnish was pale and unattractive.  I made it after spending a week at the del Gesu exhibition in New York and my head was full of foolishness.  My second and third violins I gave away to a co-worker who was laid off and could no longer afford to rent violins for his son's lessons.  Another I gave to a co-worker so she could practice with her daughter (and she liked it so she kept it - there's a story here), and the last I gave to a handyman who couldn't afford one but wanted to learn to play.  This last guy later sent me two CDs of him playing his own compositions, and he wasn't half bad.  I also made one viola as a present to my sister.

The rest I've just finished going over and getting into playable condition so I've got fifteen playable instruments and a couple made by others that still need work.  I've always been the only one of all my relations who's been interested in music (later - I take that back.  There was Stosh, but long ago and far away), so I'm not sure yet what I'll do with these things once my time is up.

[Shunyata]

I give them to kids in school string programs who have challenges paying for a rental.

[Brad Dorsey]

2 hours ago, Will Turner said:

…I'm also…trying to build recognition…and would not want the earliest instruments to be an indication of my improving efforts...

You could remove the labels and donate them to some worthy recipient without them sullying your reputation.  If asked, you could deny making them.  I hope you didn’t brand them.

[Sean Couch]

I have pondered this topic also but I don’t have much of a desire to try and sell any of my violins. I am not saying that I wouldn’t sell one if I had one hanging around and there was an interested buyer and the price was right. I ruined a previous hobby that I really enjoyed by turning it into a job so I don’t want to have the same thing happen with making violins.

I like the idea of loaning them out or donating them to students who can’t afford a rental. I know my violins are not up to snuff aesthetically, but I think they sound nice. I guess it is good that, according to the survey that was floating around here not too long ago, players aren’t concerned with looks.

My violin teacher said that my first one sounds “really good” and sounds better than some violins she has played that were made by established luthiers. After playing #2 a few weeks ago, she said I was “two for two.” They sound different, but both ring very nicely. The first one seems to have a more focused sound than the second, but I am still struggling to quantify the sound.

She is the one who gave me the contact information for her “bow guy,” who makes bows, violins, guitars, double bass, etc. I took both of my fiddles to him when I went to pick up my bow after he re-haired it. He said #2 was “perfect” except for the color of the varnish, I think he was yanking my chain a bit about it being perfect though. lol.

My teacher has been playing for 50+ years and teaching since the early 1980’s. My luthier friend has been playing/making for just as long, if not longer. They both had very nice words for my work and the bow guy told me not to stop making violins. Considering their experience, I don’t take their compliments too lightly.

With all that said, I asked Dan, the bow man, what he thought I could sell violin #2 for. He said somewhere around $2500. Not horrible, but to me, not worth it at this point considering I have 250 hours into it. $10 an hour (less if you take out my costs for wood, pegs, strings, etc) is not worth it to me to let one of mine go. I might let one go for $20 an hour. I don’t think I can get my build time much less than 250 hours. I’m kind of slow.

The plan for my violins is to keep #1, #2, and #3 in my, or a family member’s possession. Either #1 or #2 is going to be given to my mom. I am taking both on Thanksgiving to let her decide which one she likes better. I just got the form done for #3 so it will be a bit before that one is done and strung up. My daughter recently said that she wants one of my violins, so that might take care of the third. 

I won’t burn any of my fiddles no matter how orange and ugly they are. Violin #1 is now called OJ, for orange jalopy. The second is currently BB, either brown beauty or brown beast. She has opened up quite a bit since being strung up 3+ weeks ago and is turning into a real screamer. Hehe.

You are only a few years older than I am. I started making violins because I also needed an in depth hobby for my retirement. If you can sell your violins for a price you are happy with, then go for it, and start building your reputation. I think you will miss your early creations if you burn them or Frankenstein them. I know I would. They serve as very nice milestones to look at and see how your quality of work has progressed.

I bought an old display case that I modified and gave it some humidity control to hang my violins in. It can hold about 6 or 7 violins and a bunch of bows. If I ever make enough violins to satiate the family and fill the case, I will start looking at donating/loaning them. 

 

[Bodacious Cowboy]

On 11/18/2025 at 8:29 PM, Brian in Texas said:

There's a guy that I'm friends with online that's currently finishing his final year at the Chicago school, and he related a story to me. Apparently one of his instructors once said that if they had their first thirty instruments all in one place, that they'd light them all on fire.

He might not have been entirely serious about this 

[Don Noon]

The thirty owners might be really unhappy about having their violins burned. 

[HoGo]

On 11/19/2025 at 1:12 AM, Sean Couch said:

With all that said, I asked Dan, the bow man, what he thought I could sell violin #2 for. He said somewhere around $2500. Not horrible, but to me, not worth it at this point considering I have 250 hours into it. $10 an hour (less if you take out my costs for wood, pegs, strings, etc) is not worth it to me to let one of mine go. I might let one go for $20 an hour. I don’t think I can get my build time much less than 250 hours. I’m kind of slow.

$2500 is GREAT price for you if someone is willing to pay that, you forgot to calculate how much you learned during making it and that's PRICELESS. Even giving it out for free (and honest feedback) is still worth it, and you'll se how it works in real world. If you keep it in shop or under bed you won't even find any other eventual problems of your building methods.

[Mark Norfleet]

I was lucky in a way with my first instrument.  I was living in Italy on the 3rd floor of a building with a courtyard.  I was varnishing my first violin and it was hanging by an eye hook on a wire over the courtyard.  The hook was closed down so that it had a gap just large enough to go over the wire.  I was already having thoughts about what to do with it since I knew I could do MUCH better on the second one and didn't really want to put my name in it.  During lunch one day I got up to carefully turn the violin around on the wire, which I succeeded in doing.  As I pulled my arm back in my elbow plucked the wire and I watched my nearly finished instrument drop onto a cloth awning and then shoot out into the center of the concrete courtyard.  The woman who lived on the ground level after hearing the noise, but apparently not hearing three people ask her to not touch it, picked it up and said in Italian, "It's only the neck!"  Its fate was sealed and I was relieved.  My second instrument was sold to a University student, who not long after stopped playing after a bad experience at school.  She switched paths to training race horses and my instrument spent 30 years in an unheated barn until she retired.  It suffered much more once she started playing it again.  I suspect alcohol was involved.  After my second instrument I was extremely fortunate to be offered a job at what Jeffery refers to as "the firm" working with David Burgess.  After that my making improved dramatically.  So, there's really only one instrument out there with my name in it that kind of hope does not surface anytime soon.  Its owner passed a few years ago and I don't know what has happened to it.

[DBCooper]

1 hour ago, Mark Norfleet said:

I was lucky in a way with my first instrument.  I was living in Italy on the 3rd floor of a building with a courtyard.  I was varnishing my first violin and it was hanging by an eye hook on a wire over the courtyard.  The hook was closed down so that it had a gap just large enough to go over the wire.  I was already having thoughts about what to do with it since I knew I could do MUCH better on the second one and didn't really want to put my name in it.  During lunch one day I got up to carefully turn the violin around on the wire, which I succeeded in doing.  As I pulled my arm back in my elbow plucked the wire and I watched my nearly finished instrument drop onto a cloth awning and then shoot out into the center of the concrete courtyard.  The woman who lived on the ground level after hearing the noise, but apparently not hearing three people ask her to not touch it, picked it up and said in Italian, "It's only the neck!"  Its fate was sealed and I was relieved.  My second instrument was sold to a University student, who not long after stopped playing after a bad experience at school.  She switched paths to training race horses and my instrument spent 30 years in an unheated barn until she retired.  It suffered much more once she started playing it again.  I suspect alcohol was involved.  After my second instrument I was extremely fortunate to be offered a job at what Jeffery refers to as "the firm" working with David Burgess.  After that my making improved dramatically.  So, there's really only one instrument out there with my name in it that kind of hope does not surface anytime soon.  Its owner passed a few years ago and I don't know what has happened to it.

Future scholars may conclude: 

‘Norfleet did not merely conceal his early work; he subconsciously arranged Rube-Goldberg-style self-destruction events for them.’

[Sean Couch]

5 hours ago, HoGo said:

$2500 is GREAT price for you if someone is willing to pay that, you forgot to calculate how much you learned during making it and that's PRICELESS. Even giving it out for free (and honest feedback) is still worth it, and you'll se how it works in real world. If you keep it in shop or under bed you won't even find any other eventual problems of your building methods.

I agree. I don’t want them to sit and collect dust and feedback from other players would be invaluable. I just can’t let them go right now, they have sentimental value to me. Maybe my attachment to them will wane as I make more. lol.

If they are at my house, then I will play them. I have been trying to learn to play since I finished my first violin a little over a year ago. I can hear the difference between my first and second but I don’t really have the vocabulary to describe the difference that I hear.

With having two here to play, it is quite easy to keep both instruments active and I usually play both each day as I practice. I was thinking that 6 or 7 would be great, then I can play a different one each day.

[David Burgess]

Aren't you supposed to put competitors labels in them and send them out into the world? 

[Dr. Mark]

3 hours ago, Sean Couch said:

I just can’t let them go right now, they have sentimental value to me.

You, Sir...are doomed.

 

[Matthew_Graesch]

1 hour ago, David Burgess said:

Aren't you supposed to put competitors labels in them and send them out into the world? 

I thought all fiddles needed a dusty label proclaiming "Antonius Stradivarius blah blah Cremonensis made in Germany" or similar....

 

I do often wonder what will become of the instruments I've made after I'm long gone....probably the landfill, but who knows.

[Violadamore]

1 hour ago, David Burgess said:

Aren't you supposed to put competitors labels in them and send them out into the world? 

 Great idea!  Now I can finally get rid of that first Markie I botched so badly, just as soon as I find a facsimile label for........ummmm, never mind......   

[Will Turner]

2 hours ago, David Burgess said:

Aren't you supposed to put competitors labels in them and send them out into the world? 

I found one that might very well work.   

 

[Violadamore]

57 minutes ago, Will Turner said:

I found one that might very well work.   

 

Yup, with a minor addition.  

 

 

Darn, I miss Addie.  "...having the model on the label..."  He had a genius for fun.  

[David Burgess]

2 hours ago, Violadamore said:

 Great idea!  Now I can finally get rid of that first Markie I botched so badly, just as soon as I find a facsimile label for........ummmm, never mind......   

I might be willing to send you a Boygess label. I've also got Boigess, but Boygess has such higher potential manliness implications....

[nathan slobodkin]

4 hours ago, David Burgess said:

Aren't you supposed to put competitors labels in them and send them out into the world? 

indeed.

[Mark Norfleet]

5 hours ago, David Burgess said:

Aren't you supposed to put competitors labels in them and send them out into the world? 

I missed a great opportunity! 

[Will Turner]

1 hour ago, David Burgess said:

I might be willing to send you a Boygess label. I've also got Boigess, but Boygess has such higher potential manliness implications....

That would be great .   Would explain why those instruments look like they were crafted with ham hands.

[Sean Couch]

On 11/25/2025 at 2:19 PM, Dr. Mark said:

You, Sir...are doomed.

 

Probably so. 

[LCF]

On 11/26/2025 at 8:45 AM, David Burgess said:

I might be willing to send you a Boygess label. I've also got Boigess, but Boygess has such higher potential manliness implications....

Have you got any Boogess?

 

On 11/26/2025 at 5:49 AM, Dr. Mark said:

You, Sir...are doomed.

 

 

Really you should be giving them to relatives, any relatives. Brothers, Sisters, descendants, distant Cousins. We often read of such people here asking if anyone has one of their relative's violins to sell or donate. I know someone, a non-relative,  who has one of the violins made by my great Uncle and it is un-usual but I am pining to own it and HE WON'T GIVE IT TO ME. 

 

You will know that you have hit the spot when you are walking towards the front door and someone is peeking through the venetian blinds to see if you have a fiddle case under your arm before answering the door.