Maker's Question

[stern]

Current New York Tarisio Auction Violin Lot 137. Why would a maker choose to make a top with a knot like the one on this fiddle? Wouldn't it be better to make a top that doesn't have a knot?

[FiddleDoug]

You should post a picture, rather than asking us to track it down. Maybe that was his last piece of wood?

[Brad Dorsey]

23 minutes ago, FiddleDoug said:

You should post a picture...

...or a link to a picture on Tarisio's website.

[weller williams]

https://tarisio.com/auctions/auction/lot/?csid=2200469504&cpid=4141449216&filter_key=

 

[Michael Darnton]

Maybe because it didn't bother him. It doesn't bother me. There's nothing inherently wrong with a knot if it isn't in a bad place. A violinist won the Paganini Competition a couple of decades ago with a Stradivari violin with two big knots in the back. 

A knot like that one is somewhat likely to pop up later in the process, not evident right from the start.

[Don Noon]

That's a big knot.  Assuming the maker started with wedges, it would be out at the thin end where I'd find it hard to believe it would be hidden before carving.  Only the maker could say what is thinking and aesthetic decisions were; no way I'd use it.  Maybe I'd cut that edge off and splice on a wing.

[Andreas Preuss]

There were also times in the history of violin making where makers couldn’t access ‘good’ (= visually beautiful) material. Makers in Cremona working after the golden age (forcexample) used top plates with knots, back plates were made from unflamed maple, beech, chestnut and other uncommon types of wood. 
 

The reason could have been that they couldn’t afford better material and/or some supply lines dried out. In any case can a skilled maker work around smaller defects in the wood.

[KSelbach]

Knots can be something very beautiful. I love knots. It is like a unique face. I am sure there are collectors, who think the same way.

Although I like the one at the auction not so much - few days ago I had one with a knot, just finished by Lisa Hellmich and I fell in love with it’s face.
Moritz

https://hellmichviolins.de

https://hellmichviolins.de/instrumente-geigen/

[Marty Kasprzyk]

Knots make a good photo ID.

[Don Noon]

Whether you like the look or not, knots are severe disturbances and discontinuities in the grain that can cause problems, such as becoming detached and falling out.  Expansion and contraction with weather or over time will be different for the knot vs. the surrounding wood.  Sure, they CAN be OK, or be glued back in if they loosen... but as a maker, avoiding these issues is easy by getting another piece of wood.

I'm not a knot fan, particularly for large ones like these:

[GerardM]

Here’s a Nicolò Amati I photographed in the Cremona Violin Museum.

[stern]

There were also times in the history of violin making where makers couldn’t access ‘good’ (= visually beautiful) material. Makers in Cremona working after the golden age (forcexample) used top plates with knots, back plates were made from unflamed maple, beech, chestnut and other uncommon types of wood. 

In 1957?

 

 

[David Burgess]

13 hours ago, Andreas Preuss said:

There were also times in the history of violin making where makers couldn’t access ‘good’ (= visually beautiful) material. Makers in Cremona working after the golden age (forcexample) used top plates with knots, back plates were made from unflamed maple, beech, chestnut and other uncommon types of wood. 
 

The reason could have been that they couldn’t afford better material and/or some supply lines dried out.

36 minutes ago, stern said:

In 1957?

I'm thinkin' that poverty and various sorts of supply shortages had not completely gone away by 1957.

[M Alpert]

I suggest that another reason to use wood with a knot (besides those mentioned) is if you have used a bunch of billets from the same tree, perhaps you sort of know what to expect from the wood. Maybe it was good spruce, sonically, and the knot was close enough to the edge, solid enough.

Personally I like the oddity.

[Riccardo964]

knots bring character to a fiddle

just saying

[Spelman]

That looks like a dead knot, I wouldn't buy.