Age of violin, no label?

[BadgerInSpace]

Hello.

I used to restore pianos, many moons ago but know nothing about violins at all!

This violin has been in our family for at least 75 years that I am aware of.

It doesn't have a label inside.

Would it be possible for someone to give me a rough idea of its age please....is this possible with so little information?

I've included some pictures which will hopefully assist in this. The inside, from what I can see looks smooth, but I'm not sure what I should be looking for in terms of the 'good finish' I've read about?

Many thanks in advance for any help given.

Regards Howard

[Wood Butcher]

These are a fairly common style, and frequently encountered.
Somewhere around 1900, or slightly later, would seem a probable date.

[Strad O Various Jr.]

the violin has a through neck, this isn't seen hardly at all after 1870

[AaronS76]

1 hour ago, Strad O Various Jr. said:

the violin has a through neck, this isn't seen hardly at all after 1870

Can you explain how you it is possible to discern a through neck from external photos please? No challenging. Would like to learn. Thanks. 

[FiddleDoug]

1 hour ago, AaronS76 said:

Can you explain how you it is possible to discern a through neck from external photos please? No challenging. Would like to learn. Thanks. 

With a through-neck, the neck is not notched into the top plate.

[Guido]

The saddle cut into the lower rib is also an earlier feature.

The seemingly good condition and shiny varnish might be distracting from the actual age at a casual look.

I’d agree with 1860-1880.

[AaronS76]

4 hours ago, FiddleDoug said:

With a through-neck, the neck is not notched into the top plate.

Thanks!! Had to compare photos with one of mine. 

[Wood Butcher]

9 hours ago, Strad O Various Jr. said:

the violin has a through neck, this isn't seen hardly at all after 1870

I'm not sure if that is entirely the case. It would seem that for some cheaper wares, the practice continued for some time in the area they were made.

[Wood Butcher]

5 hours ago, Guido said:

The saddle cut into the lower rib is also an earlier feature.

The seemingly good condition and shiny varnish might be distracting from the actual age at a casual look.

I’d agree with 1860-1880.

I would agree that a proper set in saddle, fitted into the block would tend to point to an earlier time, but is this really set in, or just stuck to the rib to give that kind of look? I think it is the latter.

And although the finger board seems to be a bit short, I'd expect it to be even shorter, from 1860 era.

[Bob K]

It also looks like a 3/4 sized instrument. It is difficult to see exactly where the zero point on the tape measure is but if is 15mm off from the saddle, as it appears, then body is only about 335mm long.

[jacobsaunders]

I would estimate the violin to be more 1870ish. It is in a fairly fresh condition, which can confuse a little. Also the funky shading on the back always makes me think of Klingenthal rather than Markneukirchen

[BadgerInSpace]

7 hours ago, Bob K said:

It also looks like a 3/4 sized instrument. It is difficult to see exactly where the zero point on the tape measure is but if is 15mm off from the saddle, as it appears, then body is only about 335mm long.

Thanks for your reply Bob, its not too clear on the photo where the end of the tape is but I can confirm that the back of the instrument is 14 inches or 35.5 centimetres long. As I understand it, this means its a full sized violin?

I've included some more photos with measurements if that helps?

[BadgerInSpace]

6 hours ago, jacobsaunders said:

I would estimate the violin to be more 1870ish. It is in a fairly fresh condition, which can confuse a little. Also the funky shading on the back always makes me think of Klingenthal rather than Markneukirchen

Thanks for your reply Jacob. Yes ,it is in seemingly very good condition, it has been stored inside the case unused for at least the last 60 years.

At the moment its quite dirty & marked but I'm not in a rush to clean it, not sure it's a great idea?

Thanks for the information about the shading on the back & it reminding you of Kligenthal whom I assume was a maker? I'll have to google that, really interesting, thanks

[jacobsaunders]

1 hour ago, BadgerInSpace said:

reminding you of Kligenthal whom I assume was a maker? 

Klingenthal is a town, not a maker Geschichte des Geigenbaus in Klingenthal – Wikipedia

[Bob K]

2 hours ago, BadgerInSpace said:

 ......... its not too clear on the photo where the end of the tape is but I can confirm that the back of the instrument is 14 inches or 35.5 centimetres long. As I understand it, this means its a full sized violin?

Yes, if the back is 355mm (or 35.5cm) then it is full size.

Straight on views are the most helpful when looking at the dimensions & measurements.

[Wood Butcher]

22 hours ago, Strad O Various Jr. said:

the violin has a through neck, this isn't seen hardly at all after 1870

 

18 hours ago, Guido said:

The saddle cut into the lower rib is also an earlier feature.

The seemingly good condition and shiny varnish might be distracting from the actual age at a casual look.

I’d agree with 1860-1880.

You both were correct, and I was wrong.