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Help with bandsaw riser


TedN

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There is this one on amazon, but the reviews seems to suggest that it might be too long and it might need to be rewired. I was hoping to avoid hassles like that:

https://www.amazon.com/Baldor-FDL3514M-725-RPM-Industrial-Electric/dp/B0000223WH

 

4 stars from 2003:

I bought this motor because the resawing capability of the std. 3/4 hp motor on my Delta bandsaw left much to be desired. This motor does not have that problem. It has plenty of power.
For those of you considering upgrading your Delta bandsaws, I have a word of caution. The enclosed base of the saw is very tight and this motor is significantly longer than the 3/4hp std. I had to reverse the motor mounting bars inside the base and relocate the saw itself on the base(re-drilling holes) , toward the edge, to get it all to work.
Relocating the saw was important because it was the only way to make the motor pulley line up with the saw pulley. Also, if you don't make these mod's, the motor's fan sits right up against the side of the base of the saw. This make's it very difficult for the motor's fan to draw enough air to effectively cool the motor.
One other point: while the Furnas contactor that came with the saw was sufficient to handle the load of the new motor, I felt the std. wiring which is 16Ga., needed an upgrade to 14 Ga., so I did.
Lastly, the only reason that the motor doesn't get a higher grade is that there is more vibation now with it installed, than before with the 3/4hp OEM motor, which incidently was made by Marathon in the USA. I'm not sure why, but it makes one of the steel panels on the base rattle rather loudly. I will deaden the sound somehow but its just another anoyance to deal with. The good news is that the vibration has no effect on the cutting ability/stability of the saw itself. It is still smooth.
The price is great, especially because this is a Farm Duty motor. That's what the "FD" stands for in the part number

4 stars from 2003:

I bought a delta 14" bandsaw with a 6" extension kit hoping to saw up a bunch of wood. Was I mistaken! After only one afternoon of re-sawing, the emerson motor died. I have baldor motors on some other equipment with no failures , so when I found these motors on AMAZON I ordered one. (Much less costly than any other source I could find too!) Shipping was free! the motor fits perfectly,even the pulley fit correctly. However, when I hooked it up according to the Baldor supplied diagrams it ran the wrong direction. After an hour on the internet I found a wiring diagram to have the motor running in the correct direction. Now my new saw cuts great! No bogging down, no vibration and much less noise. Why in the world would Delta cripple an otherwise great bandsaw with inferior motors? They should use bigger baldor motors. I would have given the motor a five if the wiring diagram were more complete and included full instructions for directional wiring .low opp(115v) join 1,3&5 to line A; 4 to line B; join 2,J&8. and for High opp (220v) join 1&5 to line A; 4 to line B; join 2,3&8; cap J

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57 minutes ago, Mark Norfleet said:

Unfortunately the ones I have of suitable HP are DC or 3 phase.

Hi Mark - Thanks for checking. That was nice of you.

Do you think the Grizzly motor would work?

https://www.grizzly.com/products/grizzly-motor-1-1-2-hp-single-phase-1725-rpm-open-110v-220v/g2907

I just measured my Delta motor and it's about 13" in length, and I think the Grizzly motor is 12.37" in length. So I think it would fit lengthwise. 

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28 minutes ago, TedN said:

Hi Mark - Thanks for checking. That was nice of you.

Do you think the Grizzly motor would work?

https://www.grizzly.com/products/grizzly-motor-1-1-2-hp-single-phase-1725-rpm-open-110v-220v/g2907

I just measured my Delta motor and it's about 13" in length, and I think the Grizzly motor is 12.37" in length. So I think it would fit lengthwise. 

Get a scrap strip of plywood and using a tri-square mark on it exactly the back of the motor, position of the mounting plate holes, location of the belt groove in the pulley and  the end of the shaft in the motor axis direction. A motor ruler. Then try to match that exactly against specs of a new one.

If you are fitting a gap extender you'll need to lift at least the top half of the frame to do that. All you need is a beam overhead to hook a rope and pulleys to. Or a couple if strong friends. Once you've lifted half of the frame it would be easy to also lift the other half.  Since I'm not as strong nowadays as I used to be and my friends have learned to be more cautious, I used an engine lifter l had sitting around for delicate work.

The motor I have came on an 82" belt sander I bought for shaping and knife making. I replaced it with a 3 phase motor and vfd. That's an expensive way to get a motor.  Any large town would have businesses who specialise in electric motors. 

 

Edited by LCF
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Wonderful. Thanks so much for your help. I decided to go ahead and place the order. It should arrive in a couple of days. I'll let you know if it works. The rewiring diagram looked pretty straightforward. It seems reasonably easy to change the motor from clockwise to counterclockwise.

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I used a Baldor 1 1/2 HP motor as a replacement on my enclosed stand 14" Delta bandsaw and I don't recall having any problems at all getting it to fit.  I've also used a 2 HP Grizzly motor on my jointer/planer machine, and after approximately 40 years of use (yes, I'm getting old) it's still working fine without any problems. I don't give it commercial grade use, but still it's been trouble free. Grizzly still has that same motor in their catalog. Baldor or Grizzly, you'd probably by fine either way.

Something else to bear in mind, motors of this size draw a lot of amperes, especially during the start cycle. Often 115v household circuits can't handle it without tripping the breaker. In my experience they're all dual voltage motors that can be wired to 115v or 230v, and switching that is as easy as reversing the motor, but be prepared to do that and possibly run it at 230v. Often homes will have a 230v dryer circuit that can be used. I plug in to a 230v electric stove circuit.

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1 hour ago, MarkBouquet said:

 

Something else to bear in mind, motors of this size draw a lot of amperes, especially during the start cycle. Often 115v household circuits can't handle it without tripping the breaker. In my experience they're all dual voltage motors that can be wired to 115v or 230v, and switching that is as easy as reversing the motor, but be prepared to do that and possibly run it at 230v. Often homes will have a 230v dryer circuit that can be used. I plug in to a 230v electric stove circuit.

That makes me glad that I live in a country where the standard house wiring is 240V. Even so the 3HP motor on my circular saw can trip the breakers on start up. I put in a surge arrestor but it burned out. The best solution was running it on a long extension cord --- plenty of resistance and inductance to cut down the surge. 

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9 minutes ago, Mark Norfleet said:

That’s the fun part of using a 3 phase motor and a VFD, you can program the ramp up speed and limit the inrush current demands.

Good point. There are so many programmable parameters on VFDs that I ignore! I only set them up with speed control in mind. 

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19 hours ago, MarkBouquet said:

I used a Baldor 1 1/2 HP motor as a replacement on my enclosed stand 14" Delta bandsaw and I don't recall having any problems at all getting it to fit.  I've also used a 2 HP Grizzly motor on my jointer/planer machine, and after approximately 40 years of use (yes, I'm getting old) it's still working fine without any problems. I don't give it commercial grade use, but still it's been trouble free. Grizzly still has that same motor in their catalog. Baldor or Grizzly, you'd probably by fine either way.

Something else to bear in mind, motors of this size draw a lot of amperes, especially during the start cycle. Often 115v household circuits can't handle it without tripping the breaker. In my experience they're all dual voltage motors that can be wired to 115v or 230v, and switching that is as easy as reversing the motor, but be prepared to do that and possibly run it at 230v. Often homes will have a 230v dryer circuit that can be used. I plug in to a 230v electric stove circuit.

OK - Good to know. I have a Grizzly jointer planer that I had to rewire for 230v years ago. I forgot how I did that. Might need to research it a bit more. Thanks!

Maybe I should have went with the 2HP motor. Hmm...

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17 hours ago, Mark Norfleet said:

It seems like it should fit, but might take some creativity.  Did you check the shaft size?

LCF’s suggestion to measure and make a template of sorts is good.

Good luck with it!

Yes, the shaft seemed to be a match to the current Delta motor. Hopefully it's a fit.

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17 hours ago, LCF said:

That makes me glad that I live in a country where the standard house wiring is 240V. Even so the 3HP motor on my circular saw can trip the breakers on start up. I put in a surge arrestor but it burned out. The best solution was running it on a long extension cord --- plenty of resistance and inductance to cut down the surge. 

Yes, maybe I could run it on a long extension cord from the drier. Although I think there's only one 240v outlet for the drier. Maybe they sell double 240v drier outlets. hmm.

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This guy has a good video about adding the riser block. I thought I'd add it to the thread for reference:

I'm going to try to give it a go today.

I'm not sure if this helps anyone, but I'll toss the notes I took from the video below about disassembling and reassembling the bandsaw:

-take out the post, table, top wheel
-take out the pins
-put in the riser block
-so it put the riser block into the top part, and then aligned it to the bottom
-put the bolt through
-put the ruler across both wheels
-put blade guard on
-put the blade on
-put guide bar on
-I'm wondering if the guide post will work, because it doesn't have the v down the middle
-he said you can use the backside that's flat 19:00
-put the guide block on
-need to set guide block to the new blade
-take blade off
-put the table back on 23:00
-put hand knobs back on
-put the blade back on
-set guide blocks - should grab as much blade as possible, without touching the teeth
-backup bearing should touch, and then push it out a little bit
-put blade guard on
-he's saying you can buy saws from grizzly that are pretty good

 

 

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16 minutes ago, TedN said:

OK - Good to know. I have a Grizzly jointer planer that I had to rewire for 230v years ago. I forgot how I did that. Might need to research it a bit more. Thanks!

Maybe I should have went with the 2HP motor. Hmm...

The rewiring diagram will be on the motor somewhere, sometimes on the inside of the wiring box cover.

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5 hours ago, TedN said:

This guy has a good video about adding the riser block. I thought I'd add it to the thread for reference:

I'm going to try to give it a go today.

I'm not sure if this helps anyone, but I'll toss the notes I took from the video below about disassembling and reassembling the bandsaw:

-take out the post, table, top wheel
-take out the pins
-put in the riser block
-so it put the riser block into the top part, and then aligned it to the bottom
-put the bolt through
-put the ruler across both wheels
-put blade guard on
-put the blade on
-put guide bar on
-I'm wondering if the guide post will work, because it doesn't have the v down the middle
-he said you can use the backside that's flat 19:00
-put the guide block on
-need to set guide block to the new blade
-take blade off
-put the table back on 23:00
-put hand knobs back on
-put the blade back on
-set guide blocks - should grab as much blade as possible, without touching the teeth
-backup bearing should touch, and then push it out a little bit
-put blade guard on
-he's saying you can buy saws from grizzly that are pretty good

 

 

What is the height of your riser block? Living where I do coupled with the insane co$t of postage from the US --- I will make my own. 

Non-informational: I was painting the modified stand outside last night. Two weeks ago it was 40'C here (100'F). This morning it is 12'C and pouring. :-/

 

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16 hours ago, TedN said:

Yes, maybe I could run it on a long extension cord from the drier. Although I think there's only one 240v outlet for the drier. Maybe they sell double 240v drier outlets. hmm.

I'm fervently hoping that the sort of extension you might use with a 230v power point in your locale is completely different to one you would use with regular 115v power such that there would be absolutely no chance of accidentally plugging a 115v item into a 240v source ?

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2 hours ago, LCF said:

I'm fervently hoping that the sort of extension you might use with a 230v power point in your locale is completely different to one you would use with regular 115v power such that there would be absolutely no chance of accidentally plugging a 115v item into a 240v source ?

They are, unless a homeowner gets dangerously creative.  The plugs and receptacles are completely different.

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The Grizzly riser might work:

https://www.grizzly.com/products/grizzly-riser-block-kit-for-g0555lx-g0555la35/t25555?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAsIGrBhAAEiwAEzMlCze_xIZiV6WqCWqdQg6f2pWsCUvkrzD1OocFqo_YQtym4ZznwHPuhxoCtdkQAvD_BwE

Your main problem is not going to be motor power, it will be tension. A deep blade requires very high tension to keep it from flexing even a tiny bit. Real resaws have ungodly tension. If you don't have tension, the blade tries to bend backwards, but spins sideways instead and cuts out through the side of the wood in an arc. The tension on the blade is less the wider the blade is, at equivalent spring tension. Some bandsaw articles have suggested very thin (front to back) blades for this reason-that the tension available in a small saw can keep a small blade stiff enough to not twist in resawing and that this is a better choice. There was an article about this in Fine Woodworking mag long before many of you were born.

I did this when I was a guitar maker with a very cheap 10" two wheel saw. I dropped a short length of  3" diameter pipe in to extend the cutting depth to 10 inches and used it to resaw maple guitar backs with a 1/4" inch blade. As others have mentioned, big, wide teeth are needed, as few as possible, in skip-tooth style, so that chips can clear. On that saw a 1/2" blade was a disaster. When I got my 14" Grizzly I continued this idea of using 1/4" or even 3/16" skip tooth blades for resawing at maximum blade tension, and it does work very well.

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