Filippo Sciarra Posted January 15, 2023 Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 Hi all. I just bought an old 19th century violin off eBay, it looked really nice, seemed to have very little big flaws and, most importantly, I paid very little for it (considering shipment and all, about €130). I'm a pretty advanced violinist, definitely not a luthier, who wanted something to start working on in this field. I have rehaired a couple bows (with decent results, nothing spectacular), moved a couple of soundposts, refined a bridge about a year ago and changed fittings in the past, but nothing more than that. I know a bit how to work with wood, since my grandad was a carpenter and my father, when I was little, teached me lots of stuff. I didn't buy this instrument with reselling it in mind. I just want to work on it, listen to how it sounds, see how it looks, but I don't have enourmous plans for it, especially since I have not even received it. It may just be a really pretty VSO. By the way, it has no label, and a small repaired crack on the left F hole, right under the eye. I know that restoring should be left to professionals, but without any practise how will I ever learn? I'm willing to throw these money in the trash if the plan becomes a failure, but I want to try and do something. What do you think? Have you had similar experiences with these sorts of instruments? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobsaunders Posted January 15, 2023 Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 It is a cheap version of the usual with scratched on fake purfling. Looks like you rescued it from a compost heap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wood Butcher Posted January 15, 2023 Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 The nut and saddle are perfect for eBay ware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FiddleDoug Posted January 15, 2023 Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 Looks like the button/back is, or was, loose from the ribs/neck. This would need to be fixed right away. This will also affect the neck angle, which should be addressed during the fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeH Posted January 15, 2023 Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 25 minutes ago, Filippo Sciarra said: I know that restoring should be left to professionals, but without any practise how will I ever learn? Go to violin-making school. There is not really anything particularly wrong with spending time hacking-up a cheap essentially-worthless violin such as this for recreation, but please get professional training before you start learning on violins that don't belong to you or might be worth something. You don't know what you don't know, and even something as seemingly mundane as moving a soundpost can lead to serious damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blank face Posted January 15, 2023 Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 Looks like a Saxon version of a Medio Fino. Maybe not the worsest sort of instrument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratcliffiddles Posted January 15, 2023 Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 Looks totally French, cheap violin to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippo Sciarra Posted January 15, 2023 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 Thank you everyone for the feedbacks, really appreciate them. 1 hour ago, jacobsaunders said: It is a cheap version of the usual with scratched on fake purfling. Hi Jacob, can I ask you what do you mean with "fake purfling"? Do you mean painted on purfling or something else? Because this is not painted, I both asked the seller and also think it's quite clear from the pictures, you can see it where the instrument is dirty. 1 hour ago, GeorgeH said: Go to violin-making school. I, unfortunately, can't go to violin school. As much as I find it extremely fascinating, I'm already following two complete study paths (music and also finance), basically doing two bacelors at once, and wouldn't have the time nor the phisical possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobsaunders Posted January 15, 2023 Report Share Posted January 15, 2023 34 minutes ago, Filippo Sciarra said: Hi Jacob, can I ask you what do you mean with "fake purfling"? Do you mean painted on purfling or something else? Because this is not painted, I both asked the seller and also think it's quite clear from the pictures, you can see it where the instrument is dirty. If you choose an annual ring on the belly, you will find that it continues through the purfling, which it wouldn’t with proper purfling, vis the purfling is scratched on. On re-examining. BF and Peter might be right with some sort of Medio Fino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippo Sciarra Posted January 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2023 11 hours ago, jacobsaunders said: If you choose an annual ring on the belly, you will find that it continues through the purfling, which it wouldn’t with proper purfling, vis the purfling is scratched on. Oh, I see what you mean now. I thought that you meant that the violin was both scratched and with fake purfling. To be fair, it was written in the description. The seller was honest about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidStrickland Posted January 20, 2023 Report Share Posted January 20, 2023 (edited) On 1/16/2023 at 12:27 AM, Filippo Sciarra said: Hi all. I just bought an old 19th century violin off eBay, it looked really nice, seemed to have very little big flaws and, most importantly, I paid very little for it (considering shipment and all, about €130). I'm a pretty advanced violinist, definitely not a luthier, who wanted something to start working on in this field. I have rehaired a couple bows (with decent results, nothing spectacular), moved a couple of soundposts, refined a bridge about a year ago and changed fittings in the past, but nothing more than that. I know a bit how to work with wood, since my grandad was a carpenter and my father, when I was little, teached me lots of stuff. I didn't buy this instrument with reselling it in mind. I just want to work on it, listen to how it sounds, see how it looks, but I don't have enourmous plans for it, especially since I have not even received it. It may just be a really pretty VSO. By the way, it has no label, and a small repaired crack on the left F hole, right under the eye. I know that restoring should be left to professionals, but without any practise how will I ever learn? I'm willing to throw these money in the trash if the plan becomes a failure, but I want to try and do something. What do you think? Have you had similar experiences with these sorts of instruments? It looks good to me. I am thinking about buying a violin for my son. I don't have enough money to buy it. But I found https://www.socanadiancasino.com/casino-reviews/trueflip website on google search where I can find reviews for online real money gaming sites. Now, I am gonna play online real money games and when I have enough money with me, I will buy a violin for my son. It looks good to me. I am thinking about buying a violin for my son. Edited February 2, 2023 by DavidStrickland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
______ Posted January 20, 2023 Report Share Posted January 20, 2023 On 1/15/2023 at 9:25 PM, Blank face said: Looks like a Saxon version of a Medio Fino. Maybe not the worsest sort of instrument. Hats off for your kindness and words choice skills, Sir! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blank face Posted January 20, 2023 Report Share Posted January 20, 2023 As Peter said, in general it looks very French (factory) alike, just the scroll (blackened inside pegbox) and rib joints made me wonder if it wasn't made in Mnk/Schb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippo Sciarra Posted January 21, 2023 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2023 Sorry for the newbie speculation, I might be wrong, but couldn't the neck have been changed and not be the original one? It doesn't look french, it seems to have been varnished separately and with a slightly different colour, the aging is also different and there's a crack on the backside button (not sure how it's called in english, the part that connects the back to the neck), which could indicate that it has been removed before. What do you think? Am I completely off? Can I also ask the admins why this post has been moved to the auction thread? I'm pretty sure it's more well suited to the pegbox, since I've already bought the instrument and am just discussing what to do with it when it arrives? Thanks for the other tips, by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wood Butcher Posted January 21, 2023 Report Share Posted January 21, 2023 3 minutes ago, Filippo Sciarra said: What do you think? Am I completely off? Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcellow Posted January 21, 2023 Report Share Posted January 21, 2023 Bottom line. What does it sound like? I had a real old beat up violin when I was learning 50 yrs ago and my teacher said...your a lucky boy that fiddle sounds lovely...not that I knew of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippo Sciarra Posted January 21, 2023 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2023 25 minutes ago, oldcellow said: Bottom line. What does it sound like? I had a real old beat up violin when I was learning 50 yrs ago and my teacher said...your a lucky boy that fiddle sounds lovely...not that I knew of course. I still haven't received it, so I can't tell you. As I'll receive it, I will update you all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wood Butcher Posted January 21, 2023 Report Share Posted January 21, 2023 38 minutes ago, oldcellow said: Bottom line. What does it sound like? I had a real old beat up violin when I was learning 50 yrs ago and my teacher said...your a lucky boy that fiddle sounds lovely...not that I knew of course. They may have just been being kind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippo Sciarra Posted January 25, 2023 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2023 I've received the violin, everything is and was well. The G and A strings were playable and it actually sounded quite nice, a lot better, to my ear, than my €500 old Yamaha, so that's a win for me. There are no cracks to repair, the bridge seems of nice quality, same for the soundpost. There are corner blocks and a separate bass-bar, not built with the top wood. I'll have to change the pegs since they aren't great. Chinrest, tailpiece, fine tuners and endbutton are all decent and I will keep them. I'll also have to change the fingerboard and nuts (both lower and upper), I've already removed all of them with ease (fortunately). A long session of thorough cleaning now awaits me. If you have any suggestion, as always, let me know. Also, if anyone could ping this to the admins to move this back to the fingerboard thread, since this isn't, at least in my opinion, the right one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guido Posted January 26, 2023 Report Share Posted January 26, 2023 Don't clean too much, distilled water is more effective than tap water, the enzymes in saliva can work miracles (this stuff comes in bottles if you don't like your own); and dig up Jacob's recipe for violin polish on this forum if you are keen, but I wouldn't go any further or use any "products". You know you need tools for the pegs (reamer and shaver); and to do a fingerboard well is a complex task, not for beginners. Research this well! Any luthier would charge you a multiple of your violin purchase price just for a fingerboard and for good reasons. And did I mention tools? Most luthiers have a dedicated finger board plane, just as an example. Oh and on the subject of tools, of course you need to tune and sharpen them. I'd recommend you get a Tormek and some water stones :-) It's hard to do this just a little bit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strad O Various Jr. Posted January 26, 2023 Report Share Posted January 26, 2023 The through neck would seem to indicate against French origin and point to Saxon/Bohemian, though I guess English is not impossible, unless its nailed on neck in which case it would need a normal top block Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippo Sciarra Posted January 26, 2023 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2023 10 minutes ago, Guido said: Don't clean too much, distilled water is more effective than tap water, the enzymes in saliva can work miracles (this stuff comes in bottles if you don't like your own); and dig up Jacob's recipe for violin polish on this forum if you are keen, but I wouldn't go any further or use any "products". You know you need tools for the pegs (reamer and shaver); and to do a fingerboard well is a complex task, not for beginners. Research this well! Any luthier would charge you a multiple of your violin purchase price just for a fingerboard and for good reasons. And did I mention tools? Most luthiers have a dedicated finger board plane, just as an example. Oh and on the subject of tools, of course you need to tune and sharpen them. I'd recommend you get a Tormek and some water stones :-) Thanks a lot for the suggestions, I already have quite a few tools, stones, and a bit of experience sharpening since I do it with kitchen knifes. The pegs will probably be the most annoying part, since I don't have neither a reamer nor a sharpener. There are chinese ones on Aliexpress, I've heard decent thing about them if you sharpen and set them up correctly, and, most importantly, they don't cost a fortune, but I'll see. I'm not in a rush, luckily. Another problems will be the planes, since I have a lot of really big ones, from my grandfather who was a carpenter, but very little small one, just one, and will probably need to buy a few more. To clean it, I don't think I'll use anything more than just water and a mild soap. It already looks quite good like this. Maybe I'll try Jacob's recipe, but a couple of ingredients are a bit harder to find for me here, in Italy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guido Posted January 26, 2023 Report Share Posted January 26, 2023 10 minutes ago, Strad O Various Jr. said: The through neck would seem to indicate against French origin and point to Saxon/Bohemian, though I guess English is not impossible Seems to be morticed, shallow, as to be expected from a Frenchie at that time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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