Seeking Info on Roman Teufel Violin

[Eddie Merribaker]

Hello, friends! I recently came into possession of a violin made by Roman Teufel. In my rather vast collection of violin reference books, I could only find a couple mentions—namely that his violins date from the early 1800’s and that he hailed from the Mittenwald region. The workmanship is high-quality, and both of the books I own that have entries on Teufel praise his violins’ “haunting, singing tone.”

Just trying to ascertain the value. Mine has a fascinating backstory and I’m hoping to trade notes with anyone out there whom also owns a Roman Teufel violin. Thanks! 

Edited October 20, 2022 by Eddie Merribaker
Additional Details

[jacobsaunders]

I have never heard of a Mittenwald maker of the 19^th C named Teufel. Would you like to provide pictures?

[Spelman]

That is a weird last name

[Wood Butcher]

1 hour ago, jacobsaunders said:

I have never heard of a Mittenwald maker of the 19^th C named Teufel. Would you like to provide pictures?

Would Roman have been common as a Christian name?

[jacobsaunders]

50 minutes ago, Wood Butcher said:

Would Roman have been common as a Christian name?

No, I can't think of a single "Roman" from there from the 19th C

[Wood Butcher]

I thought this would be the case.
I wonder if we have a misread name, and it could be something else, such as Roman Teller.

[Blank face]

Obviously he made Strad copys with a devil's head instead of the scroll. Certainly a variation of the Mittenwald lionhead violins. Reportedly Paganini owned one, too.

[Eddie Merribaker]

17 hours ago, Blank face said:

Obviously he made Strad copys with a devil's head instead of the scroll. Certainly a variation of the Mittenwald lionhead violins. Reportedly Paganini owned one, too.

 
No devils head on mine! Lol

[FiddleDoug]

Just for laughs, Google translate says that Teufel means Devil. Are you sure you want to keep that around?

[FiddleDoug]

Google doesn't show any references to violin Makers named Teufel, but there is this.

https://raamatupood.utlib.ee/en/fiction/9901-die-teufel-roman-band-1-3.html

[Eddie Merribaker]

16 minutes ago, FiddleDoug said:

Just for laughs, Google translate says that Teufel means Devil. Are you sure you want to keep that around?

Eek! ;-)

[Eddie Merribaker]

21 hours ago, Wood Butcher said:

I thought this would be the case.
I wonder if we have a misread name, and it could be something else, such as Roman Teller.

No, it’s definitely Roman Teufel. I’ll post pics soon.

[Blank face]

1 hour ago, FiddleDoug said:

Just for laughs, Google translate says that Teufel means Devil. Are you sure you want to keep that around?

And Roman (in German) translates to "novel". It's always possible that a maker isn't listed in any of the big dictionaries like Lüttgendorf, or that it's just a dealer's or repairer's label, but counting together "devil's novel" and the tale about "haunting sound" it's likely that someone just made a spooky joke, which was copied by another encyclopedist and was the model for a spurious label, counting on the usual flawed assumption "Who the devil would fake a Teufel label".

But I'm curious for the photos.

[pyrola_asarifolia]

Teufel is not absurd as a surname. The former prime minister of the Land of Bade-Wurttemberg was Erwin Teufel. This map shows it's primarily a name in the SW/South. https://www.kartezumnamen.eu/index.php?sur=teufel&s=Suchen .

 

(As for Roman as a given name, this site claims it took up in Germany in the 1950s though the former president of Germany, Roman Herzog, was born in 1934. https://www.beliebte-vornamen.de/16660-roman.htm . I personally would expect a builder named Roman Teufel to be a 20th century person, 2nd half. Though Mittenwald isn't a bad place for the name.) 

[Gesche]

This is quite hard to google, since as you said.. the name "Roman" translates to "novel" and "Teufel" is a very common word, so if you google "Roman+Teufel+Geige", this novel keeps popping up.

[Blank face]

13 hours ago, pyrola_asarifolia said:

Teufel is not absurd as a surname. The former prime minister of the Land of Bade-Wurttemberg was Erwin Teufel. This map shows it's primarily a name in the SW/South. https://www.kartezumnamen.eu/index.php?sur=teufel&s=Suchen .

 

(As for Roman as a given name, this site claims it took up in Germany in the 1950s though the former president of Germany, Roman Herzog, was born in 1934. https://www.beliebte-vornamen.de/16660-roman.htm . I personally would expect a builder named Roman Teufel to be a 20th century person, 2nd half. Though Mittenwald isn't a bad place for the name.) 

That’s all valid, nonetheless I’m guessing it’s a sort of Halloween joke.

[Eddie Merribaker]

On 10/21/2022 at 6:54 PM, pyrola_asarifolia said:

Teufel is not absurd as a surname. The former prime minister of the Land of Bade-Wurttemberg was Erwin Teufel. This map shows it's primarily a name in the SW/South. https://www.kartezumnamen.eu/index.php?sur=teufel&s=Suchen .

 

(As for Roman as a given name, this site claims it took up in Germany in the 1950s though the former president of Germany, Roman Herzog, was born in 1934. https://www.beliebte-vornamen.de/16660-roman.htm . I personally would expect a builder named Roman Teufel to be a 20th century person, 2nd half. Though Mittenwald isn't a bad place for the name.) 

I read in a book about German first names that the name Roman was a popular name in the early 1800s. I’ve also read that Teufel is not that uncommon of a last name in Germany. A quick google search bears this out.

[Eddie Merribaker]

On 10/21/2022 at 1:34 PM, Blank face said:

And Roman (in German) translates to "novel". It's always possible that a maker isn't listed in any of the big dictionaries like Lüttgendorf, or that it's just a dealer's or repairer's label, but counting together "devil's novel" and the tale about "haunting sound" it's likely that someone just made a spooky joke, which was copied by another encyclopedist and was the model for a spurious label, counting on the usual flawed assumption "Who the devil would fake a Teufel label".

But I'm curious for the photos.

The label is legit. I’ve even heard from a couple people on Facebook that own (or have owned) violins made by Teufel. I own several very high-end violins, and to my ears, the Teufel has them all beat. She’s done wonders for my creative muse. 

[Blank face]

7 hours ago, Eddie Merribaker said:

The label is legit. I’ve even heard from a couple people on Facebook that own (or have owned) violins made by Teufel. I own several very high-end violins, and to my ears, the Teufel has them all beat. She’s done wonders for my creative muse. 

You might excuse the speculations and jokes about this rather extraordinary maker's name, but we are used to judge violins by more than just hearsay and still waiting for photos for several days. I guess that most people here are very curious to learn about relative unknown makers, but in the actual state that's not possible.

Even some quick shots by a phone might give an idea, and there's a description how to take proper photos pinned at the top of this website.

[pyrola_asarifolia]

11 hours ago, Blank face said:

You might excuse the speculations and jokes about this rather extraordinary maker's name, but we are used to judge violins by more than just hearsay and still waiting for photos for several days. I guess that most people here are very curious to learn about relative unknown makers, but in the actual state that's not possible.

Just to clarify, I implied in no way that I think it's more likely than not that this is the name of a real maker. Most of the names on labels are fictional after all. Just that this German doesn't think this is a weird or particularly remarkable name. (Yeah, with all the devil-violin associations I also do understand why some may make jokes.)

In fact, if there is a maker with this Realname he would have to be flying pretty deeply under the radar. I can find a video/film producer with a studio and a single documentary that made it on critics' radar. 

[Eddie Merribaker]

On 10/23/2022 at 6:04 PM, pyrola_asarifolia said:

Just to clarify, I implied in no way that I think it's more likely than not that this is the name of a real maker. Most of the names on labels are fictional after all. Just that this German doesn't think this is a weird or particularly remarkable name. (Yeah, with all the devil-violin associations I also do understand why some may make jokes.)

In fact, if there is a maker with this Realname he would have to be flying pretty deeply under the radar. I can find a video/film producer with a studio and a single documentary that made it on critics' radar. 

I’m new to this message board. I’m also under the weather. I will figure out how to post pics when I feel better.  It is indeed true,  “A picture’s worth a thousand words.”