JacksonMaberry Posted March 24, 2022 Report Share Posted March 24, 2022 Hey folks, Lots of ground topics lately and I'm happy about it. It's one of my favorite topics! Most of the threads have dealt with discussion, which is excellent and helps us all move forward. But what I'd like to do here is encourage folks to post a photo or two of their ground and tell us about their personal approach. Of course we should talk about it, too, but mostly it think it would be fun to see what everyone is up to. Here's what I'm doing right now. I first introduce some color and boost contrast with a synthetic Roubo tincture. Then the ground itself is a varnish of cold pressed linseed oil (Detwiller Linseed Products in Canada), aloe ferrox, and congo copal. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James M. Jones Posted March 24, 2022 Report Share Posted March 24, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonMaberry Posted March 24, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2022 Looking good! Tell us a bit about it, if you like. Is that varnished, or just the ground. I ask because the luster gives the impression of a film above the wood surface, but if you've just burnished really thoroughly that could explain it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James M. Jones Posted March 24, 2022 Report Share Posted March 24, 2022 Just now, JacksonMaberry said: Looking good! Tell us a bit about it, if you like. Is that varnished, or just the ground. I ask because the luster gives the impression of a film above the wood surface, but if you've just burnished really thoroughly that could explain it What you see … It’s just one very very thin cote above the ground . As thin as humanly possible. the ground is as per R Hargrave, both are the same process except the second pic is highly oxidized over many years sitting in a desk drawer , it was my first body made , the first picture was of the last body made … basically the Rubio red original version left a few hours in the sun , then slaked plaster heavily applied and rubbed back , then a long cooked resin , dark cooked oil rosin mastic varnish applied appallingly heavy and wiped back with a cheese cloth to as little as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joerobson Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 Balsam Ground on untreated wood. (it has not been suntanned,artificially tanned, or chemically treated) Both had a small dose Aged Wood Gold color added to the Ground. I usually allow some sun exposure after ground application. on we go, Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonMaberry Posted March 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 48 minutes ago, James M. Jones said: What you see … It’s just one very very thin cote above the ground . As thin as humanly possible. the ground is as per R Hargrave, both are the same process except the second pic is highly oxidized over many years sitting in a desk drawer , it was my first body made , the first picture was of the last body made … basically the Rubio red original version left a few hours in the sun , then slaked plaster heavily applied and rubbed back , then a long cooked resin , dark cooked oil rosin mastic varnish applied appallingly heavy and wiped back with a cheese cloth to as little as possible. Fantastic, thanks! Really appreciate your sharing. Looks good, sir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonMaberry Posted March 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 9 minutes ago, joerobson said: Balsam Ground on untreated, that is suntanned,artificially tanned, chemically treated, wood. Both had a small dose Aged Wood Gold color added to the Ground. I usually allow some sun exposure after ground application. on we go, Joe Heck yeah, Joe! That's the stuff. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Bress Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 UV + SN + gypsum/rosin varnish paste rubbed on and rubbed off. Same application process I showed you when Elijah and I stopped by. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonMaberry Posted March 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 3 minutes ago, Jim Bress said: UV + SN + gypsum/rosin varnish paste rubbed on and rubbed off. Same application process I showed you when Elijah and I stopped by. Glorious, Jim! Sure enjoyed hanging out with you and Eli! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berl Mendenhall Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 Here is my new ground system. 1st. picture is the back side of this piece of wood. Not much figure, pretty faint. 2nd. Plaster of Paris. Made a paste and rubbed in well. Then rubbed off excess after drying. 3rd. One coat of balsam ground. 4th. Second coat of balsam ground. 5th. After 3 coats of spirit varnish. I’m going to do some experiments with adding color to the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Noon Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 It will likely be several months before I get another instrument together, but here are some garlands with ground on them. It's resin/solvent (not shellac), with varying small amounts of orange analine dye added. Since there is no drying oil in the ground, the dye is quite stable. The garlands are all torrefied, with some being much darker than others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charliemaine Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 Aloe Ferrox coloring... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonMaberry Posted March 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 Thanks for sharing, folks! Berl, when you say balsam ground, do you use Joe's or is it your own recipe? Looks good! Don, very neat! The anilines make sense given the lack of oil. I know of some other top flight makers that incorporate anilines to great effect too. Charliemaine, you're the reason I got interested in aloe years ago! Took me a while to get to a method I liked, but making it with an oil base as opposed to alcohol has made all the difference for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berl Mendenhall Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 23 minutes ago, JacksonMaberry said: Thanks for sharing, folks! Berl, when you say balsam ground, do you use Joe's or is it your own recipe? Looks good! Don, very neat! The anilines make sense given the lack of oil. I know of some other top flight makers that incorporate anilines to great effect too. Charliemaine, you're the reason I got interested in aloe years ago! Took me a while to get to a method I liked, but making it with an oil base as opposed to alcohol has made all the difference for me Jackson, this is “my” first attempt at making a balsam ground. It’s heat treated colophony crushed fine and mixed with mineral spirits. I would like to have had some good turpentine, I didn’t want to wait on an order I was impatient wanted to play with this stuff. The mineral spirits didn’t completely dissolve the resin, but enough to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonMaberry Posted March 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 7 minutes ago, Berl Mendenhall said: Jackson, this is “my” first attempt at making a balsam ground. It’s heat treated colophony crushed fine and mixed with mineral spirits. I would like to have had some good turpentine, I didn’t want to wait on an order I was impatient wanted to play with this stuff. The mineral spirits didn’t completely dissolve the resin, but enough to work. Understood! I have done something similar in the past to good effect, larch turpentine dissolved in some pure gum spirits of turpentine (diamond g). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charliemaine Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, JacksonMaberry said: Charliemaine, you're the reason I got interested in aloe years ago! Took me a while to get to a method I liked, but making it with an oil base as opposed to alcohol has made all the difference for me Your AF ground looks great. What is your procedure for making it with an oil base. I'd like to try that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeC Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 4 hours ago, charliemaine said: Aloe Ferrox coloring... I like the red-ish color in the deep part of the curl and more yellowish in the light stripes. Most grounds are too monochromatic for my tastes. There's an old thread here somewhere called Red Stripes or Red Flames. I would like to replicate some of the grounds shown there. Something like this... but I ain't there yet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Harte Posted March 26, 2022 Report Share Posted March 26, 2022 Unfortunately I only have close ups of some samples from a while ago. The shot below was taken recently under a single incandescent bench light. The bottom mid to right is ground (UV plus stain followed by clear oil varnish.) What I'm doing now is probably slightly less veiled looking but it's hard to tell as each piece of wood behaves differently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berl Mendenhall Posted March 26, 2022 Report Share Posted March 26, 2022 5 minutes ago, John Harte said: Unfortunately I only have close ups of some samples from a while ago. The shot below was taken recently under a single incandescent bench light. The bottom mid to right is ground (UV plus stain followed by clear oil varnish.) What I'm doing now is probably slightly less veiled looking but it's hard to tell as each piece of wood behaves differently. I like your comment each piece of wood behaves differently. Great admiration for those ( Davide Sora comes to mind ) who has a great system and can duplicated it every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonMaberry Posted March 26, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2022 13 minutes ago, John Harte said: Unfortunately I only have close ups of some samples from a while ago. The shot below was taken recently under a single incandescent bench light. The bottom mid to right is ground (UV plus stain followed by clear oil varnish.) What I'm doing now is probably slightly less veiled looking but it's hard to tell as each piece of wood behaves differently. Gorgeous, John. Thanks for sharing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berl Mendenhall Posted March 26, 2022 Report Share Posted March 26, 2022 There are some amazing grounds here. I’ve been away from violin making for a few years. Looks like I need to play catch-up. Very impressive everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Rosales Posted March 26, 2022 Report Share Posted March 26, 2022 1 hour ago, Berl Mendenhall said: There are some amazing grounds here. I’ve been away from violin making for a few years. Looks like I need to play catch-up. Very impressive everyone. Agreed. Also very useful for us newbies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Bress Posted March 26, 2022 Report Share Posted March 26, 2022 1 hour ago, John Harte said: Unfortunately I only have close ups of some samples from a while ago. The shot below was taken recently under a single incandescent bench light. The bottom mid to right is ground (UV plus stain followed by clear oil varnish.) What I'm doing now is probably slightly less veiled looking but it's hard to tell as each piece of wood behaves differently. John, could you explain a little more on what you mean by veiled? thanks, Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Harte Posted March 26, 2022 Report Share Posted March 26, 2022 2 hours ago, Jim Bress said: John, could you explain a little more on what you mean by veiled? thanks, Jim Jim, I'm probably going to dig a massive hole for myself here... There are a lot of things that I look for in what I suppose could be broadly considered ground. One is the ability to see into wood structure and clearly see detail which, in turn, seems related to how structural detail reflects light. Blurred or veiled detail usually seems to dull the type of reflectivity that I am wanting to see. The degree of transparency within the wood structure and depth to which you can see into the structure and the degree of contrast at various incident light angles between those structural elements that reflect light, and those that do not, seem important in achieving a certain sort of look that I find appealing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Harte Posted March 26, 2022 Report Share Posted March 26, 2022 3 hours ago, JacksonMaberry said: Gorgeous, John. Thanks for sharing! Thanks. The last 40 years of messing with this stuff have mostly been 1 step forward and 10 backwards.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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