gaseff Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 Seeking advice on finishing (refinishing)... I am pretty sure the sight of this violin will hurt people’s souls. The story is that there was a US-based entertainer (think Jack Benny crossed with Victor Borge) who used this violin in his act. He unfortunately painted his violin in 3 coats of non-latex paint (light green, dark green and yellow, if it matters). After 2 weeks and many hours of painstaking, and as gingerly as possible, paint removal with bio-friendly and advertised as “gentle” strippers – this is the result. I am looking for ideas and advice on techniques and products to attempt to resurrect the look that this lovely old German (?) lady deserves. All rants and constructive ideas welcomed. (Also, I am in MN new member probationary status so can only make a couple of posts per day before I am shut off for 24 hours.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobsaunders Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 Dustbin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FiddleDoug Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 You have a lot more problems than just the finish! That said, putting it in the dustbin seems kind of wasteful. I'd vote for the kindling box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Darnton Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 Too late to be asking questions. Should have asked before stripping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blank face Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 I'm sure that it looked better with the multicolor finish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duane88 Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 it was more valuable as a cultural artifact of Jack Benny and his show... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaseff Posted February 18 Author Report Share Posted February 18 I figured.... What would be the issues with treating like a newly built violin and finishing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Burgess Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 32 minutes ago, duane88 said: it was more valuable as a cultural artifact of Jack Benny and his show... I'm thinkin' that the Jack Benny thing was a metaphor for a stage prop. Jack Benny actually used his Strad on stage, at least some times. He was a frequent customer of ours at the Weisshaar shop, and if he owned any junk, we never saw it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle duke Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 37 minutes ago, gaseff said: I figured.... What would be the issues with treating like a newly built violin and finishing it. First, you have to do the crack repairs and try to make them look like they were not there in the first place. Then, those peg holes may need bushings installed and drilled/reamed for new pegs. Then, you see those dark patches and circular sanding marks? With those still on the wood you can't say an unvarnished new violin appearance. But if you can get the wood repairs done you can still put something on there for a finish and have a violin but it won't be worth any money afterwards and may very well sound sort of ho hum for a violin tone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avandesande Posted February 18 Report Share Posted February 18 Is it possible to lightly go over the violin with a scraper to remove the sanding marks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bungling_amateur Posted February 19 Report Share Posted February 19 Could just repaint it to return it to its "original" state? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctanzio Posted February 19 Report Share Posted February 19 Get some Zinsser Amber Shellac and dilute it 1 part denatured alcohol to 1 part shellac by volume. Let it sit overnight in a capped glass jar so most of the wax settles to the bottom. If you want to add a teensy more color to the finish, there are alcohol-based dyes from manufacturers like TransTint. A fraction of a drop is all you need. Reddish-brown tint is good for hiding the scars of paint removal in your case. With a soft brush flow it on fast and thin. Let it dry, about an hour, frequently less. You can try a second coat but shellacs can dissolve previous coats and anything with dye added to it can become streaky. If you get overlap lines, thoroughly dried shellc sands nicely with 800 to 1500 grit sand paper and a light touch. If you do not add dye then the amber color will come across more consistently until the coat gets a bit too thick, then you can get visible melt marks unless you learn how to use a french polishing technique. Another option is any general-purpose spar varnish. Easy to apply and get a smooth coat, but all the wood coloration damage due to stripping will show thru the light orange-brown tint of the varnish. Really not worth spending much time or money refinishing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeDeF Posted February 20 Report Share Posted February 20 On 2/18/2022 at 5:49 PM, avandesande said: Is it possible to lightly go over the violin with a scraper to remove the sanding marks? Wouldn't that be "aprésdesande?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobP Posted February 20 Report Share Posted February 20 On 2/18/2022 at 2:49 PM, avandesande said: Is it possible to lightly go over the violin with a scraper to remove the sanding marks? Yes, but be careful. You don't want to thin or reshape the plates. At this point you can't do it any more harm. I'd pull it apart, fix the assorted cracks, do whatever it takes to get the dark discoloration out of the back plate joint without thinning/altering the plate, glue back together, and then refinish with whatever method/varnish you feel works for you. If you can't get the dark discoloration out of the joint, then I'd go with as dark of a varnish as possible to hide it. This will hide the other figuring of the wood, so you'll have to make that decision based on which of the 2 is more important to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaseff Posted February 20 Author Report Share Posted February 20 Thank you for ideas. Appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobP Posted February 21 Report Share Posted February 21 On 2/20/2022 at 11:08 AM, gaseff said: Thank you for ideas. Appreciated. You can tint shellac with the colors from TransTint. You can also tint oil varnish with artist oil paints. Some finishes are acrylic based, if the one you use is like this you can tint with artist acrylic paints instead of oil paints. Why not go wild and choose a purple tint for the varnish? Or green? Can't hurt and it might make you famous. Or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaseff Posted February 21 Author Report Share Posted February 21 Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strad O Various Jr. Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 Tonally, a shellac finish would be one of your worst options IMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James M. Jones Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 5 minutes ago, Strad O Various Jr. said: Tonally, a shellac finish would be one of your worst options IMHO Why do you say that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strad O Various Jr. Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 1 hour ago, James M. Jones said: Why do you say that? experience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James M. Jones Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 19 minutes ago, Strad O Various Jr. said: experience Would you care to elaborate ? I just ask because there is a whole range of Shellac, hard, soft thick, thin with additional resins , gums …. And many very fine instruments with any number of combinations. oil type varnishes also come in a wide variety of mixes and when “improperly” applied can have a lot of effect on tone as well .it’s hard to really believe one is categorically bad and another good .So I guess what I am asking is what sort of difference or down side do you see in what sort of recipe? I have only used Oil varnish for primary finish and once in a while some shellack mixes over the top for antiquing and touch ups . My decision to use oil has more to do some sort of historical attachment to classical Cremona than tonal concerns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strad O Various Jr. Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 Pure shellac finishes make a hard brittle tone lacking in midrange, very bright in a bad way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James M. Jones Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 Just now, Strad O Various Jr. said: Pure shellac finishes make a hard brittle tone lacking in midrange, very bright in a bad way Thank you . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctanzio Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 How much shellac are you painting on your violins? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Merkel Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 You could sell it on ebay saying it's a violin that needs varnish, then use the money to buy a new violin that needs varnish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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