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Old violin Identification


Cannabeast
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Hello, 

 

I bought this violin from a pawn shop a while back. I just got it fixed so I can start playing and the lady at the violin shop said it was super old. She said that it has an ebony chin rest, tail piece, and pegs. And it has cat gut securing the tailpiece. It has a label that says it is an strad copy but doesn't say where from. I was wondering about how old is this violin? Also if it's worth more than the fifty I paid. Any additional information would be appreciated too! I can upload different pictures too. See Thanks in advance guys! 

 

 

 

 

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10 hours ago, Cannabeast said:

...the lady at the violin shop said it [is] super old...

It's not.

This violin was made by the Jackson-Guldan Violin Company of Columbus, Ohio.  According to the Wenberg book, it operated from about 1920 to 1960, and in the early 1920s it was producing 36,000 instruments a year.  Many of them were distributed by Mongomery Ward and Targ & Dinner.  I have seen a lot of these violins.  This one looks better than most.

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51 minutes ago, Brad Dorsey said:

It's not.

This violin was made by the Jackson-Guldan Violin Company of Columbus, Ohio.  According to the Wenberg book, it operated from about 1920 to 1960, and in the early 1920s it was producing 36,000 instruments a year.  

Did they actualy "make" any at all, or did they just have "their" workshop in Schönbach/Luby

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Your question has got me thinking.

I’m quite sure that Jackson-Guldan made a lot of violins, because I see many, bearing their labels, that are of a dreadful type that I haven’t seen coming from anywhere else.  But I may have made the foolish error of assuming that they made any instrument that bears their label, as this one does.  As I said, this one is better that most Jackson-Guldans that I see.  So if this one smells of Schonbach to you, it seems likely that J-G sourced some instruments from there.  And this would explain something about the labels that I have wondered about.  Some labels are printed “Jackson-Guldan Violin Company, Columbus, Ohio” at the bottom, and other labels, like the one in this violin, have had the bottom cut off, which would be because the violins that they inhabit were not made in Ohio.

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3 hours ago, Brad Dorsey said:

It's not.

This violin was made by the Jackson-Guldan Violin Company of Columbus, Ohio.  According to the Wenberg book, it operated from about 1920 to 1960, and in the early 1920s it was producing 36,000 instruments a year.  Many of them were distributed by Mongomery Ward and Targ & Dinner.  I have seen a lot of these violins.  This one looks better than most.

Brad,

Looks German Czech to me also. What did you see that makes you think Jackson Gulden?

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4 hours ago, Brad Dorsey said:

Your question has got me thinking.

I’m quite sure that Jackson-Guldan made a lot of violins, because I see many, bearing their labels, that are of a dreadful type that I haven’t seen coming from anywhere else.  But I may have made the foolish error of assuming that they made any instrument that bears their label, as this one does.  As I said, this one is better that most Jackson-Guldans that I see.  So if this one smells of Schonbach to you, it seems likely that JG sourced some instruments from there.  And this would explain something about the labels that I have wondered about.  Some labels are printed “Jackson-Guldan Violin Company, Columbus, Ohio” at the bottom, and other labels, like the one in this violin, have had the bottom cut off, which would be because the violins that they inhabit were not made in Ohio.

Wow! After looking at the pictures, before reading the rest of the thread, my impression was "looks kind of like a Jackson-

Guldan".

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Jackson-Guldan did make some violins of more conventional construction. I have one in the shop right now labelled Guldan Special. Most of theirs though were made with a one piece rib garland with corners added to the outside of the Garland. And the one I have looks nothing like the OP violin. 

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21 hours ago, nathan slobodkin said:

Brad,

...What did you see that makes you think Jackson Gulden?

I committed the neophyte mistake of going by the label.  This violin has a Jackson-Guldan label in it, identifiable as such by the word "Model" at the top.   These labels were also printed “Jackson-Guldan Violin Company, Columbus, Ohio” at the bottom, but this was cut off of some labels, as it was in the label shown above.  I always wondered why, and I have figured out why as a result of this thread:  They imported some violins from Schonbach and stuck the same labels in them, but with the bottoms cut off due to import labeling regulations, since these violins weren't made in the USA.  If you look at the label in the pictures above, you will see that there is an ample margin at the top but no margin at the bottom, and the bottom is cut off out-of-parallel with the script.

I have seen so many of these labels in cheap violins that I figured out many years ago that a label that says "Model" at the top is a Jackson-Guldan label.  Today I realized that the ones with the bottoms cut off are in imported violins.

 

16 hours ago, Michael Darnton said:

...I never see violins that bad, so I don't know much about them...

You've got to get out and do more slumming.

Unfortunately, it seems that I see violins this bad too often, so I have developed some niche expertise in them.  I remember showing David Bromberg a J-G about 30 years ago, thinking that since it was American-made he might be interested in it.  I was astounded when he declared it a J-G after looking at it for about a quarter of a second at arm's length, but now I can do the same.  Some people are good at identifying Strads and Del Gesus;  I can identify Jackson-Guldans and Medio Finos.

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“The fifth maker whose instruments can be found all over America is the Jackson-Guldan Company. The Jackson-Guldan factory made what I believe are the only violins ever to have been made completely by machinery. They made thousand and thousands of them, proving to me at least that violins should be made by hand.”

David Bromberg, from a lecture on American Violin Makers in 2007.

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18 hours ago, stringcheese said:

Jackson-Guldan did make some violins of more conventional construction. I have one in the shop right now labelled Guldan Special. Most of theirs though were made with a one piece rib garland with corners added to the outside of the Garland. And the one I have looks nothing like the OP violin. 

If I read this right does that mean that four maple corners were just glued to the outside?

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On 1/13/2022 at 10:38 AM, jacobsaunders said:

Did they actualy "make" any at all, or did they just have "their" workshop in Schönbach/Luby

Yes they built them.  I taught with Luke Danials daughter.  Luke bought Jackson Guldan the 60's.  There were a lot of old craftsman there in danger of loosing their jobs from overseas competition.  He saved the jobs for while by switching to mass production bending of plates.  I think he was a pretty good guy trying keep people in jobs.

 I started building instruments.  Annette Danials (Luke's daughter) tells me she has a bunch of old violin wood at the school that was given to the construction class.  My mouth started drooling.  Tons of old 1960's European  maple and spruce!!!  Free!!!  I go up in the storage space and below is what I found.  Spruce.  Probably Sitka from Canada I assume.   Lots of it, yes.  All used for bending.  Anettes brother supposedly has some of the old molds and has bent a plate or two in the past.

So this is some of the actual wood from the factory. Here it still sits.  I use it for linings. 

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20 hours ago, Brad Dorsey said:

Joe, I think it’s amazing to have someone here who has a direct connection with Jackson-Guldan.  What else can you tell us?

I don't know much.  Annette, Luke's daughter is still alive in Columbus.  I remember she told me that Luke was trying to get politicians to  change some tariffs or such to fend off the foreign violin  coming from Asia in the 1960's, unsuccessfully.  She also told me a story of them burning violins and wood as the factory was finally shutting down.  That is about it.   David Shlub who owns the The Loft Violin Shop in Columbus might know more.  He has been doing violins in Columbus Ohio his whole life.  Nice guy.  Honest guy.  Runs an extremely competent shop that does the gambit from rentals to high end restorations. 

 

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