Jump to content
Maestronet Forums

Luigi Azzola violin 1916


Alexander Stewart
 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 145
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

41 minutes ago, Alexander James Stew said:

Dear Gtone,

I took some better close-ups of the violin including the back. I hope they help to clarify your question.

Hey thanks for obliging us Alexander,

you have a great night as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Alexander. The label and written ink certainly looks legit and it looks like an inside mould may have been used for the build?

Someone commented earlier in the thread about the dark bits around the edges - in these photos it just looks like bits of old residue that needs cleaning. I don't know what it is about the tops of corners but dirt always seems to accumulate more there than anywhere else.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Aurella said:

Thanks Alexander. The label and written ink certainly looks legit and it looks like an inside mould may have been used for the build?

Someone commented earlier in the thread about the dark bits around the edges - in these photos it just looks like bits of old residue that needs cleaning. I don't know what it is about the tops of corners but dirt always seems to accumulate more there than anywhere else.

Dear Aurella,

I was pleased to get a good pucture of the label with natural daylight. One can tell the "16" is written clearly in ink. The local violin maker here did an "ultraviolet" test on the label with a blue light...and told me the label was probably from the time of construction of the violin. As regards an inside mould ...I honestly don't know. And yes dirt tends to accumulate in the corners. I would also like to know if anyone has seen a pre 1920 Luigi Azzola...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

UV merely tests for the presence of optical brighteners, when it's use started c.1950.

Plenty of paper have no opitical brighteners.  So a UV test can not be a dispositive test for age.

I would hope that you pursue due diligence with a bit more rigour than what's been revealed thus far.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, Hempel said:

UV merely tests for the presence of optical brighteners, when it's use started c.1950.

Plenty of paper have no opitical brighteners.  So a UV test can not be a dispositive test for age.

I would hope that you pursue due diligence with a bit more rigour than what's been revealed thus far.

Dear Hempel,

Many thanks for the information. I think that is exactly what the violin maker said. He was pretty sure when he conducted the UV test that the paper was pre 1950. But yes I can't prove the paper is from 1916. The way the ink has faded on the number "16" ....Is there anyway that one can check the age of the ink?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, Hempel said:

 

I would hope that you pursue due diligence with a bit more rigour than what's been revealed thus far.

Steady on ....

I have been sceptical about this violin (and still am TBH), but as far as I know Alexander is a happy owner not a prospective seller and he is under no legal or moral requirement to do "due diligence".

Anyone who proudly posts images of their Benito Frascati violin here on Maestronet must accept some level of professional dubiety with good grace as he has done, but he's not obliged to know any more about his violin than he already does.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, martin swan said:

Steady on ....

I have been sceptical about this violin (and still am TBH), but as far as I know Alexander is a happy owner not a prospective seller and he is under no legal or moral requirement to do "due diligence".

Anyone who proudly posts images of their Benito Frascati violin here on Maestronet must accept some level of professional dubiety with good grace as he has done, but he's not obliged to know any more about his violin than he already does.

 

Many thanks Martin.

Yes I am  a very happy owner of this violin especially for its tonal qualities and colour but I would love to know if anybody comes across a pre 1920 Luigi Azzola... Interesting to compare....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, martin swan said:

Steady on ....

I have been sceptical about this violin (and still am TBH), but as far as I know Alexander is a happy owner not a prospective seller and he is under no legal or moral requirement to do "due diligence".

Anyone who proudly posts images of their Benito Frascati violin here on Maestronet must accept some level of professional dubiety with good grace as he has done, but he's not obliged to know any more about his violin than he already does.

 

Martin,

There's a world of difference between:

On 10/15/2021 at 12:53 PM, Alexander James Stew said:

And by the way I had a test done on the label... The paper is over 100 years old.

 

2 hours ago, Alexander James Stew said:

I was pleased to get a good pucture of the label with natural daylight. One can tell the "16" is written clearly in ink. The local violin maker here did an "ultraviolet" test on the label with a blue light...and told me the label was probably from the time of construction of the violin. 

More than a few participants on this thread voiced their skepticism on how (i.e. which tests) the label was determined to be "over 100 years old."

But then I wouldn't expect you to understand this distinction.  And only a fool would expect a fiddle to be forever in the possession of a single person.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Alex has a long history on this forum of stretching the truth about his bows and violins, that's why I'm more than a little bit skeptical of this one, even though I'm certainly not any kind of expert on 20th century Italian violins, when he says he has had it appraised by so and so, I have no idea what that means, pictures, in person, fantasy, who knows

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To clarify it a bit: I was really surprised when the OP came up with the last two sets of photos and spent some time comparing to find out if it really shows the same instrument and label. Obviously many of the points making me very sure in the first place that both label and violin were cheap fakes were based on some over-processing of badly taken photos, the appearance of the label, varnish etc. So this I had to set right. 

OTOH this doesn't mean that I can tell or have any clear opinion now wether both label and instrument are what is claimed. The violin looks like a slightly irregular but nicely made instrument in a good state and the label isn't crying clearly fake as I thought it would before. There's still the possibility that it is something else, or even a more refined fake, but that's now beyond my experience and knowledge. Therefore, as it was said several times now, the last word belongs to the few qualified experts in the field of modern Italians.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

35 minutes ago, Strad O Various Jr. said:

Alex has a long history on this forum of stretching the truth about his bows and violins, that's why I'm more than a little bit skeptical of this one, even though I'm certainly not any kind of expert on 20th century Italian violins, when he says he has had it appraised by so and so, I have no idea what that means, pictures, in person, fantasy, who knows

" A long history"... That's pretty OTT..... I joined in June and what is " stretching the truth" supposed to mean? It's so easy to pass judgement on others. All I have done here is share photos of my violin which I am very proud to have and state it has had a verbal appraisal from a knowledgeable expert. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Shelbow said:

I found this image is on an Asian database apparently of a 1913 Azzola bit it had no reference to who owns it or where it was purchased from.

20110715051816625.jpg.bc558c5f817697c60db7bf5e3f884ee6.jpg

 

I saw this, too, but the database is listing everything without any evidence or provenance so it is very unreliable and should be ignored.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Blank face said:

To clarify it a bit: I was really surprised when the OP came up with the last two sets of photos and spent some time comparing to find out if it really shows the same instrument and label. Obviously many of the points making me very sure in the first place that both label and violin were cheap fakes were based on some over-processing of badly taken photos, the appearance of the label, varnish etc. So this I had to set right. 

OTOH this doesn't mean that I can tell or have any clear opinion now wether both label and instrument are what is claimed. The violin looks like a slightly irregular but nicely made instrument in a good state and the label isn't crying clearly fake as I thought it would before. There's still the possibility that it is something else, or even a more refined fake, but that's now beyond my experience and knowledge. Therefore, as it was said several times now, the last word belongs to the few qualified experts in the field of modern Italians.

Dear Blank face,

I guarantee that this is the same violin. These are photos I took over the last 2 days. I am not here to try deceive everyone. This all started because I was asked to share photos of my LUIGI AZZOLA from 1916

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Alexander James Stew said:

Dear Blank face,

I guarantee that this is the same violin. These are photos I took over the last 2 days. I am not here to try deceive everyone. This all started because I was asked to share photos of my LUIGI AZZOLA from 1916

That's allright.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...