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5 hours ago, Muswell said:

I made my own toothed blade using a cutting disc in my Proxxon. It's easy to do.

Many people prefer that, with a slightly uneven tooth spacing, because the blade tends to track in the grooves from the last pass less than the blades with machined, regularly-spaced teeth.

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I think the teeth can be formed by just putting a bunch of slots in the cutting edge with a little fine-edged cold chisel and hammer.   Then you would have to remove the burrs and raised metal between the teeth, by honing the flat side of the blade, to restore the flatness.  If you make the slots approximately evenly spaced by eye, they will be irregular enough to prevent tracking.  After repeated blade sharpenings the teeth will disappear, so you reform them by the same method.

I know it seems sacrilegious to intentionally mar a blade that you would normally take great pains to keep pristine.  But you have probably noticed that when you plane wood with a nicked blade, the planed surfaced has a little raised ridge left by the nick.  A toothed blade is simply a regular blade with a lot of deep nicks intentionally made in the cutting edge to leave a lot of high ridges.

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4 hours ago, chiaroscuro_violins said:

I haven't struggled with the blade tracking when I've used them before, but if a homemade one is just as good, I see no reason to spend money on it.  Do you use the proxxon/dremel freehand?  What cutting wheel would you recommend to keep the kerf to a minimum?  

Thanks for the replies!

Yes freehand and the disc was 0.9mm, although the actual notch is a bit bigger.  The blade works just fine.

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 I am probably not the best person to listen to as I am perhaps too easily satisfied with my own toolmaking efforts. But I made this toothed iron by using a hammer and cold chisel to form the teeth on an old blade which was a bit useless as it is a bit soft but the softness of the metal was advantageous when chiseling the teeth and it works quite well as a toothed iron. The uneveness of the teeth arose quite naturally (rather like Austin Powers teeth, I am  English after all?) as I chiselled them judging the spacing by eye. Perhaps a finer spacing would be better?

P1080195.JPG

I made the blade seen in the top left by filing grooves on the unhardened blade (sweedish knife steel bought from Dictum) and it works well but I probably need to reharden it as it is a bit soft

P1080099.JPG

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I made my toothing plane blade from old plane blade already hardened. I didn't want to kill the temper with grinding discs and used simple small triangular diamond file right against the sharp edge. I tried to get regular intervals but of course the file will not start the cut at planned spot and wander a bit so I got nice irregular teeth. Works great.

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Of course toothed blades track to some extent. But having unevenly spaced teeth won't change that. All that you can do is plane in slightly different directions. I've just used a Veritas block plane fitted with one to plane rough sawn ribs and there will always be high sections left preventing further progress. The solution is to follow up with a plane fitted with a plain blade. In the case of ribs both blades should be sharpened at a cutting angle of at least 50 deg. to prevent tearout.

 

 

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My toothing plane is somethng like 55° angle and I plane ribs with blade slightly askew. I change the angle for every stroke from 30 degrees towards left to 30 degrees towards right edge and never have to use normal plane in between. I finish with well sharpened (square edge) cabinet scraper to perfectly smooth.

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On 9/28/2021 at 9:44 PM, chiaroscuro_violins said:

Hi all, 

I have a Lie-Nielsen No. 60 1/2 block plane which I use for pretty much everything.  I would like to obtain a toothed blade for it.  Has anyone here found a source to purchase one?  I have an old blade I can modify, but I want to make sure I know what I'm doing so as not to waste good steel.  

Thanks!

You should be able to order a toothed blade for your 60 1/2 directly from Lie-Nielsen. Just call them. I've never had a problem with regularly spaced tooth blades. A properly honed LN toothed blade will leave a near mirror like finish on your ribs if you back it in far enough on your final passes.

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8 hours ago, Dennis J said:

Of course toothed blades track to some extent. But having unevenly spaced teeth won't change that.

I believe it will, unless you put the plane in exactly the same place on subsequent strokes. With evenly space grooves, even if you start the stroke to one side or another of the previous stroke, enough of the grooves will still line up to "steer" the plane.

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21 hours ago, MikeC said:

Andrew I'm curious about your arching.  The shadow under the scraper makes it look like you have a lot of recurve and not much convex arch across the lower bout or does it just appear that way in the photo? 

(Apologies for going off the toothed blade topic!)

Hello Mike, my arching is probably quite 'eccentric'. I have up to now been mainly concerned with experimenting and learning how to use and make tools to make a violin. I have deliberately avoided thinking too much about design and concentrated on the 'mechanics' but realise now I would have avoided a few problems if my outlines had been thought out a bit more and if had used less irregular shaped wood. I like the idea of doing arching from the inside first so have done that on each of my three violins.

My back arching was determined a little bit by wood I used - harvested from the local churchyard so I felt I had to try to use it! - my two backs are shown here before I started

P1070097.JPG

I carved the arching and used some measurements (seen here written on the back next to where they occur) for depth of arching at the centre of the back, off some strad posters along with my simple depth guage/stick thing

P1070113.JPG

I then tried to make the internal arching look nice to my highly untrained eye here are the two hollowed backs showing the arching

P1070176.JPG

So my strange external arching then followed what had been set by the internal arching. ( If you want to see more, or larger photos, I have posted lots more on my very poorly structured blog, here https://oldenoch.blogspot.com/2020/07/i-still-cant-bake-my-oven-is-still-cold.html in the Post which has a photo of a trumpet at the start. I am still posting photos here but since joining Maestronet have been putting my stuff on my thing in the 'Contemporary Maker's Gallery' as my blog was not being viewed much)

My lack of experience and tendency to be too easily pleased have resulted in this strange arching but I have learned a lot, well a bit, from my mistakes and for my fourth violin I plan to take more care with design type matters as an integral part of the making process.

 

Back to toothed blades!

4 hours ago, David Burgess said:

I believe it will, unless you put the plane in exactly the same place on subsequent strokes. With evenly space grooves, even if you start the stroke to one side or another of the previous stroke, enough of the grooves will still line up to "steer" the plane.

I have read that hand cut files were valued because their irregular teeth did not 'track' so helped them work better. I think I may have read that machine made files were improved by altering the machines to make the teeth less regular?   Similarly with hand cut rasps the irregularity of the teeth makes them work better.

The Dieter Schmidt fine tools catalogue says

" Hand-cut rasps function differently from machine-cut rasps. They cut faster and leave a surprisingly smooth finish thanks to the excellent surface quality, extra sharpness, and slightly irregular layout of their teeth. "

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21 hours ago, Dennis J said:

Of course toothed blades track to some extent. But having unevenly spaced teeth won't change that. All that you can do is plane in slightly different directions. I've just used a Veritas block plane fitted with one to plane rough sawn ribs and there will always be high sections left preventing further progress. The solution is to follow up with a plane fitted with a plain blade. In the case of ribs both blades should be sharpened at a cutting angle of at least 50 deg. to prevent tearout.

Nope. You can plane off as much stock as needed. irregular teeth are faster in removing stock and since the teeth resist tearing you can sharpen at normal angles.

 

 

 

21 hours ago, Dennis J said:

 

 

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