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Cello, Mario Gadda workshop


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49 minutes ago, PhilipKT said:

PS in English there’s only one way to say “the.” In German, there are 24...ways to say “the.”

OY!

...and in Russian and Farsi...there is no "the"...

Very economical!

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Back in the days that German was new to me, I had great problems with that. By the time I had worked out which gender was correct, and which case or which preposition, I had forgotten what I was going to say anyway. One day I decided that from now on, everything was “die” and sod it. From that day on I found first that nobody minded and second that my ability to have a conversation skyrocketed.

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8 hours ago, martin swan said:

There are not 24 ways to say "the " in German.

 

Theoretically  8 casi multiplied with 3 gender 24 are correct; but factually many of them are identical: die Frau, die Frauen, die Kinder, des Mannes, des Kindes etc; plural has one for each casus but all genders.

Bestimmter und unbestimmter Artikel - Deutsch Daf Arbeitsblatter

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Italian is a posh language to speak but, unless you are in Italy, it is a rather useless language.

Violin and art books are not published in Italian. I love renaissance and baroque Italian sculpture, if you want good books about it, they will be written in English. There is no good, comprehensive book about Verrocchio, Cellini, Giambologna etc. in Italian. The same for Guarneri del Gesù.  That's why I always urge young makers to study English. 

Players in Italy are bad paid, so most of them can not afford good contemporary instruments. I receive many inquires from Italian violists, but the negotiation finishes in the price. When I visit my family in Italy I  even don't take violas with me.

Ok, there is all the cultural Italian background that speaking Italian gives but, to me, speaking German or Korean would be much more useful.

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My spoken German was really good, grammatically, UNTIL I started taking German classes in High School and University. 

Then it became worse. The way I was taught grammar rules messed with my native speaking skills. :angry:

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4 minutes ago, MANFIO said:

...speaking German or Korean would be much more useful.

I think learning German has become almost pointless, from a practical viewpoint. Almost all Germans speak excellent English.

Learning Russian might actually be more useful.

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2 minutes ago, Rue said:

I think learning German has become almost pointless, from a practical viewpoint. Almost all Germans speak excellent English.

Learning Russian might actually be more useful.

Yes, this is 99.5% true for professional musicians... But it seems Germans feel more confident when they are speaking German... I do have this feeling...

 

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1 hour ago, martin swan said:

There are not 24 ways to say "the " in German.

 

Doch 


Der die das die

den die das die

dem der dem den

Des der des der

and so on. Several words serve different functions but yes, 24 different grammar versions.

I had the option once of buying a t-shirt with all of them emblazoned thereon, but I passed.

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1 hour ago, jacobsaunders said:

...One day I decided that from now on, everything was “die” and sod it. From that day on I found first that nobody minded and second that my ability to have a conversation skyrocketed.

Yes. I more or less gave up too. If it's wrong, it's wrong. And that's never held me up either.

What does hold me up is just a lack of accessible vocabulary at a higher level. When you're constantly halting your speech as your brain searches for words that you may or may not know...it becomes tiresome for both the speaker and the listener.

One thing I noticed recently is that I  know many more words than I can actually recall while speaking.

That means I can follow a more involved/complicated conversation compared to what I could verbally contribute to.  I think it's because those are words I never actually ever needed to speak.

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BTW...my current ESL student struggled this week, at work, with simple instructions.

Take the lid off..

Lift the lid off...

She has a Ph.D...I am reading her papers. Something to do with gamma irradiation ^_^. She's been so focused on technical writing and grammar rules that her basic grasp of we'd consider simple language skills has suffered. Her reading comprehension is great.

The rest? Not so much. 

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1 hour ago, PhilipKT said:

Doch 


Der die das die

den die das die

dem der dem den

Des der des der

and so on. Several words serve different functions but yes, 24 different grammar versions.

I had the option once of buying a t-shirt with all of them emblazoned thereon, but I passed.

That's all the same word with different modifications - and that's the whole 16 (no "and so on"), in which you will see that there are only six actual variants :lol:

Sorry, I see Blank face already covered this ...

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3 hours ago, jacobsaunders said:

Back in the days that German was new to me, I had great problems with that. By the time I had worked out which gender was correct, and which case or which preposition, I had forgotten what I was going to say anyway. One day I decided that from now on, everything was “die” and sod it. From that day on I found first that nobody minded and second that my ability to have a conversation skyrocketed.

That made me laff laff.

Just wait till you have a go at Mandarin!

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1 hour ago, martin swan said:

That's all the same word with different modifications - and that's the whole 16 (no "and so on"), in which you will see that there are only six actual variants :lol:

Sorry, I see Blank face already covered this ...

This is one of those rare circumstances where we are both correct, depending on whether we are focusing on the letter of the law or the spirit.
points for us both!

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1 hour ago, Rue said:

Yes. I more or less gave up too. If it's wrong, it's wrong. And that's never held me up either.

What does hold me up is just a lack of accessible vocabulary at a higher level. When you're constantly halting your speech as your brain searches for words that you may or may not know...it becomes tiresome for both the speaker and the listener.

One thing I noticed recently is that I  know many more words than I can actually recall while speaking.

That means I can follow a more involved/complicated conversation compared to what I could verbally contribute to.  I think it's because those are words I never actually ever needed to speak.

Mark Twain suggested that if you toss out every word eventually you’ll hit on the right one and everyone will be happy. The Germans love nothing more than a run-on sentence.

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4 hours ago, PhilipKT said:

This is one of those rare circumstances where we are both correct, depending on whether we are focusing on the letter of the law or the spirit.
points for us both!

There is no such thing as the spirit of the law ... only the letter of the law :lol:

Admit defeat!

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1 hour ago, martin swan said:

There is no such thing as the spirit of the law ... only the letter of the law :lol:

Admit defeat!

My brother is a lawyer, and he repeats the lawyers mantra, which is, “when the spirit is on your side, argue the spirit of the law. When the letter is on your side, argue the letter of the law, and when neither is on your side, shake your fist and yell a lot.”

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17 hours ago, jacobsaunders said:

Back in the days that German was new to me, I had great problems with that. By the time I had worked out which gender was correct, and which case or which preposition, I had forgotten what I was going to say anyway. One day I decided that from now on, everything was “die” and sod it. From that day on I found first that nobody minded and second that my ability to have a conversation skyrocketed.

That's exactly the way immigrants verhunzen the German language.:P In reality many native German speakers are unable to use all the forms correctly, too; within many dialects is a tendency to replace the different pronomina with one or two identical forms, and some urban slangs are leaving them out completely (clearly influenced by migrantic kids). Of course one should think that the correct way to use der, die, das etc. is just a way to seperate different classes of people, by education, wealth or other backgrounds, so it might change in a modern world anyway.

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Auction houses do that. The less responsibility for them the better. I have a Gadda violin. Certificate, build, varnish seem almost identical. Problem is that nobody knows who exactly made these in the Gadda workshop. Tarisio calls them  "instruments form the late Mario Gadda workshop"

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  • 1 month later...
  • 2 weeks later...
On 7/8/2021 at 2:47 AM, Violadamore said:

......And if they weren't Italian, they'd just be "rubbish".  :P :lol:

Correct, I played the cello. It was quite poor with a weak C string (why have a cello with a weak C?). Sold for about £7,000 plus buyers premium. 

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