Trading musical instruments after Brexit


Recommended Posts

Does anybody know which rules will apply for trading with instruments between the UK and the EU according to the "Christmas miracle deal"?

It's obvious that every importer now will need to pay VAT (so there will be extra costs or bureaucratical effort), but what about the now obligatory documentary evidence of origin and all the other highly complicated regulations? Couldn't find anything within the official informations, nor about antiques, art etc.

For example here:

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/trading-with-the-uk-as-an-overseas-exporter

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/trading-with-the-uk-as-an-overseas-exporter#rules-of-origin-for-tariff-preference

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/notice-831-european-union-binding-origin-information

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/import-and-export-notices-alphabetical-order

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 52
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

At present the UK government has no idea, and is putting out contradictory information even on its own websites.

So it's no wonder that plonkers like Tim Martin (owner of Wetherspoons and arch-Brexiteer) don't think they will have to pay import VAT on EU goods after Brexit!

In brief, if the deal is ratified by parliament tomorrow, what it means is that there will be no tariffs between the UK and the EU, but that any goods coming into the UK from the EU or going to the EU from the UK will be subject to import VAT at the appropriate rate. In the UK this is 20% for musical instruments or 5% for antiques.

If you are a VAT registered business you can reclaim this - if you're a private individual you can't. So anything entering the EU from the UK and bought by a non-VAT registered individual or business will cost 20% more. Sam for things imported into the UK from the EU.

This really hasn't been talked about at all in the media, and it's going to be a very rude awakening for everyone. The effect on trade in musical instruments between the UK and the EU will be catastrophic.

There will also no longer be any shared agreements about ivory and tortoiseshell, so all movements of these materials between the UK and the EU will now need CITES licenses.

Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, jacobsaunders said:

I hope that one of the auctioneers who frequent this site will make an attempt to address this question

I would also be interested, though I would expect a stony silence ... it's pretty clear that if an auction house is going to ship an item they need to do it with full customs paperwork - so anything bought from a UK auction will incur import VAT on arriving in the EU. Also the inter-EU VAT exemption rules won't apply any more, so if you're VAT registered and have been benefitting on a VAT exemption on the buyer's premium, that won't happen any more.

The impact will definitely be worst for private individuals or businesses who aren't VAT registered. For VAT registered businesses on either side of the channel it's just a lot of new paperwork and accounting, all of which costs money.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, martin swan said:

I would also be interested, though I would expect a stony silence ... i

 

Since Einführumsaststeuer (your import VAT) on antiques is 10% here, that would mean 10% + on an instrument (should it be older than 100 years) and 20% on their 22% commission, quite apart from shipping costs, so it will probably be more worthwhile to just deal here, and let the English keep their junk, should the stony silence persist:)

Link to post
Share on other sites

In Germany the VAT for antiques is 19%. Beside that, I'm also concerned about the declaration of origin. This seems to be an essential part of the deal and meant to prevent that third party's products could be exported as a  tariff privilegued product of the one side, EU or UK. Maybe it's not so important, because most of the violins are German anyway, the rest Italian:), but theoretically it could be necessary to offer a costy and often otherwise unnecessary certificate of origin. I also had some Swiss violins from time to time, which aren't products of the EU.

Not to mention American or Japanese electric guitar parts.:huh:

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, germain said:

I don't think UK/ US trading agreements will be changed in any way. The new changes apply between the UK and EU only right?

Actually there aren't any trading agreements between the UK and USA. Great Britain was part of the EU and hadn't trade agreements on it's own. There are very elaborated trade agreements between the EU and Canada or Japan for example, which now won't apply to Britain anymore, and another agreement between the EU and USA (TTIP) was subject of long year negotiations, but now paused by the (yet) actual US government (which supported Brexit for a Divide et Impera ideology). We'll see what the next US government will do, but it looks as if they will have a bigger interest in a deal with the much more extended EU market than with the significant smaller UK.

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Blank face said:

Actually there aren't any trading agreements between the UK and USA. Great Britain was part of the EU and hadn't trade agreements on it's own. There are very elaborated trade agreements between the EU and Canada or Japan for example, which now won't apply to Britain anymore, and another agreement between the EU and USA (TTIP) was subject of long year negotiations, but now paused by the (yet) actual US government (which supported Brexit for a Divide et Impera ideology). We'll see what the next US government will do, but it looks as if they will have a bigger interest in a deal with the much more extended EU market than with the significant smaller UK.

Good point

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/30/2020 at 3:12 AM, Blank face said:

Actually there aren't any trading agreements between the UK and USA. Great Britain was part of the EU and hadn't trade agreements on it's own. There are very elaborated trade agreements between the EU and Canada or Japan for example, which now won't apply to Britain anymore, and another agreement between the EU and USA (TTIP) was subject of long year negotiations, but now paused by the (yet) actual US government (which supported Brexit for a Divide et Impera ideology). We'll see what the next US government will do, but it looks as if they will have a bigger interest in a deal with the much more extended EU market than with the significant smaller UK.

I would resist applying notions like "Divide et Imperia" to the current US Prez. Just one populist reactionary nationalist narcissist wanker happy to fuel the flames wherever he can for attention. There is nothing deeper than that- at least not between the current POTUS's ears.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry for addng an unedequate sarcasm; this shouldn't be the topic here.

To take an optimistic point of view, from tomorrow onwards the EU-membership of Great Britain will be part of the past, which is always memorized with a certain golden luster. So the next campaign might be "let's get re-unification done".:)

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Blank face said:

Sorry for addng an unedequate sarcasm; this shouldn't be the topic here.

To take an optimistic point of view, from tomorrow onwards the EU-membership of Great Britain will be part of the past, which is always memorized with a certain golden luster. So the next campaign might be "let's get re-unification done".:)

As far as I can tell, Brexit will have as its direct consequence the break-up of Great Britain, since Scotland wants none of it and Northern Ireland wants much more of it. So very soon we will be talking in glowing terms about the possible re-unification of Great Britain.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Wood Butcher said:

It's the baying Scottish leader who wants independence, much more than the people do.

You mean our dear sweet Nicola?

OK ... let's review this time next year. I bet you £100 that Scotland will have voted in favour of independence. It's not just Brexit, which was overwhelmingly rejected by the Scottish electorate - it's also seeing the damage being done in Westminster by a bunch of Eton shirt-lifters and their myopic henchmen.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, martin swan said:

OK ... let's review this time next year. I bet you £100 that Scotland will have voted in favour of independence. It's not just Brexit, which was overwhelmingly rejected by the Scottish electorate - it's also seeing the damage being done in Westminster by a bunch of Eton shirt-lifters and their myopic henchmen.

popcorn-and-drink-smiley-emoticon.gif.8ebcc38f73a3c30edc18d4f6d51a7aca.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, martin swan said:

You mean our dear sweet Nicola?

OK ... let's review this time next year. I bet you £100 that Scotland will have voted in favour of independence. It's not just Brexit, which was overwhelmingly rejected by the Scottish electorate - it's also seeing the damage being done in Westminster by a bunch of Eton shirt-lifters and their myopic henchmen.

 

Yup.  I wouldn't touch that bet with a six-foot claymore.  Nice turn of phrase in the last sentence, BTW.  :ph34r:  :lol:

Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, martin swan said:

You mean our dear sweet Nicola?

OK ... let's review this time next year. I bet you £100 that Scotland will have voted in favour of independence. It's not just Brexit, which was overwhelmingly rejected by the Scottish electorate - it's also seeing the damage being done in Westminster by a bunch of Eton shirt-lifters and their myopic henchmen.

 

Ah, I see now.
So if the politicians weren't gay, and hadn't been to Eton, you think Westminster would be better run :wacko:

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, jacobsaunders said:

Since Martin recently fled Scotland for Somerset, we can rest assured that he is putting his money where his mouth is:)

Twas only 20 years ago that the City (guffaw) of Wells was judged the Heroin capital of the south west.

Zummrrzzeeht is a lovely county though.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.