Any insight Jacob S. and Blankface


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This instrument, described as "Violin, Füssen School", sold for a decent sum at yesterday's Skinner auction ($9500usd+ premium = $11,875).  I was wondering if either of you had more information to share beyond the lot description:

Description
Violin, Füssen School, labeled Michael Hartung/liutaro fece in Padova/l'anno 1689., length of back 359 mm, with case.
Estimate $4,000-6,000

Sound post cracks to top and back. Numerous restorations to table including patches to f-holes. Rib cracks. The top and back both inscribed externally.
 
DGSR :)
 
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2 hours ago, mendicus said:

I think it could be Polish violin, like Groblitz

Yes, the head made me briefly think of Groblitz too, the body less so. The fact is, that there were quite a few Hanseatic makers. Everyone has heard of Tielke, but there was also a Goldt in Hamburg for instance, and goodness knows how many others. I am not aware of any Füssen connection they may have had, but who knows?

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I guess that Füssen has a similar meaning here like Tyrol, i.e. "we don't know" (I agree with this:)). The ff have not much in common with Füssen IMO. Maybe "Hanseatic" would be a better description, even Danzig was part of the Hanse at some period. Also violin makers/journeymen could have moved easily from one city to another.

 

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You don't see too many violins from the Tielke era or there about for sale. Tarisio lists one Tielke sold at auction in 1989 for almost 60K. Never even seen a Goldt, Tarisio lists a viola sold in 1995 for almost 50K. 

I can see if a collector thought that it was from that time and place, and wanted one, they would have to live with a back crack, and pay up. 

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The problem with all the violins of this period that I aggregated as “Hanseatic” above, is that they all have these squarish lions heads with their chins up. Since there is a dearth of reference examples with undisturbed original labels, I fail to see how one may reliably tell them apart.

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2 hours ago, ______ said:

I found some other (of poorer quality) photos of Groblicz influence in an old book.

Viola da gamba, viola bastarda and 2 violins. All circa 1600.

There were also several generations of Groblic. Such datings as "ca. 1600" I would take always with a spoon full of salt. Could be also much later. Labels were often enough reprinted, dates overwritten or added etc.

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On 11/20/2020 at 10:55 PM, Violadamore said:

Looks like it might have been copied from the prow of something sailing through the Baltic........  :lol:

Hanseatic01.thumb.jpg.207ef552c744a1af7e3c5c6ba63ec09d.jpg

Might be, but that would have happened about 6, 7 or 8 centuries before the making date of the violin...:)

At the right of this photo is a head by Gottfried Thielcke of Königsberg 1662:

lions.JPG

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3 hours ago, Blank face said:

There were also several generations of Groblic. Such datings as "ca. 1600" I would take always with a spoon full of salt. Could be also much later. Labels were often enough reprinted, dates overwritten or added etc.

I agree. There were Marcin Groblicz I, II, III, IV, and V.

Labels are just labels. Dendro could be more accurate here since there were no direct connection between some of their generations.

Ex. Groblicz I lived in Cracov and died ca 1610 while Groblicz II lived in Warsaw and was born ca 1670.

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3 hours ago, Blank face said:

Might be, but that would have happened about 6, 7 or 8 centuries before the making date of the violin...:)

Yup, of course.  The head on the OP violin is still an amazingly poor rendition of s lion, which was my point.  :P:lol:

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