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Sticky violin bow hair after cleaning with alcohol


Namila Nandi
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4 hours ago, sospiri said:

It could be shellac that the bow was finished with that is making it sticky? In which case use more alchohol.

The original finish on a bow will not transfer to the hair IMHO.  But if some ebay seller is slathering shellac on old bows and gets it on the hair, then I suggest getting the bow rehaired.  And don't buy from that seller again. :)

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21 hours ago, jacobsaunders said:

Should your bow be varnished (with shelac or whatever else) removing the varnish is not the aim, but removing the dirt.  If you wash your own hair in the shower, you use shampoo, not alcohol, unless you're a bit weird

I didn’t explain it very well. I was referring to shellac getting on the hair as a result of cleaning with alchohol. 

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19 hours ago, violinsRus said:

The original finish on a bow will not transfer to the hair IMHO.  But if some ebay seller is slathering shellac on old bows and gets it on the hair, then I suggest getting the bow rehaired.  And don't buy from that seller again. :)

I’ve seen it on old bows. How the shellac got on the hair is another question. Maybe the fiddler had vey strong whisky breath? 

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On 7/20/2020 at 9:13 AM, jacobsaunders said:

don't use any bloody alchohol!

:D  In this case I think it's too late for that.  Now the objective for the OP is to remove whatever the alcohol spread around.  Some alcohol in a dish with a toothbrush works fine.  I've used it successfully many times, but you do have to be careful not to get it on the stick.  It's not difficult to do.  Isopropyl alcohol is good because it does not leave a residue, unlike some "denatured" alcohol.

Of course if you do that, you have to reapply rosin from scratch, and I don't mind doing that.  Shampoo sounds like a good idea, and I guess it might not remove the rosin, and it won't remove the varnish.  The only thing is, I think shampoo is usually formulated to leave a little oil in the hair so it doesn't become too unruly.  I would suggest something like Dawn liquid dish detergent instead.

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27 minutes ago, La Folia said:

:D  In this case I think it's too late for that.  Now the objective for the OP is to remove whatever the alcohol spread around.  Some alcohol in a dish with a toothbrush works fine.  I've used it successfully many times, but you do have to be careful not to get it on the stick.  It's not difficult to do.  Isopropyl alcohol is good because it does not leave a residue, unlike some "denatured" alcohol.

Of course if you do that, you have to reapply rosin from scratch, and I don't mind doing that.  Shampoo sounds like a good idea, and I guess it might not remove the rosin, and it won't remove the varnish.  The only thing is, I think shampoo is usually formulated to leave a little oil in the hair so it doesn't become too unruly.  I would suggest something like Dawn liquid dish detergent instead.

I suggested "cif" which is for cleaning the toilet, Shampoo or washing up liquid is a substitute if you don't have any cif. Having washed the hair, you rinse it (with water) and wait untill it has dried. Splashing about with alcohol is stupid.

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13 minutes ago, jacobsaunders said:

I suggested "cif" which is for cleaning the toilet, Shampoo or washing up liquid is a substitute if you don't have any cif. Having washed the hair, you rinse it (with water) and wait untill it has dried. Splashing about with alcohol is stupid.

Easy there cowboy, slashing about with toilet cleaner and water is not exactly rocket surgery either....

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Be SURE NOT TO GET ANY WATER OR ALCOHOL in the TIP or FROG!!

I've used alcohol pads to clean bow hair for years with no problem. You must thoroughly clean the hair, however. I find that requires at least 8 swipes with alcohol pads. I always clean the entire length of hair. That can be done with 4 pads using each side only once and wiping off the dissolved rosin immediately after each swipe with a clean, dry cotton cloth surface (diaper quality).

EDIT: ONE IMPORTANT THING TO REMEMBER: Do not try to re-rosin the cleaned bow hair until it no longer feels cool to the skin on the back of your hand.

I recently had 2 bows rehaired because I thought it was time after all those years of alcohol-pad cleaning - but they are just about the same as they were.

EDIT: Hair is dead and dry, alcohol will not kill it. They still sell alcohol-containing VITALIS "hair tonic," which I did use for a while many years ago - see my hair now! Still there!!:rolleyes: My cello teacher used a small Vitalis bottle to carry his vodka in - but that was 70 years ago and that's another story.

Edited by Andrew Victor
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34 minutes ago, La Folia said:

Is it secured with hide glue?

Water is a problem.  It can cause deformation of tips causing them to pop off or leaving them permanently deformed, and it can cause cheek cracks as blocks expand... Alcohol can can cause problems as well with finishes and coating the hair with liquid rosin.  The real issue here, is bows need to be rehaired for more reasons than the hair being dirty; in fact it is incredibly rare for that to be the primary reason. As the hair stretches with use, it stretches unevenly which can cause dramatic decreases in performance and even long term damage to sticks that are warped as a result.  Spend the money to have a rehair rather than risk long term damage with alcohol, or TOILET BOWL CLEANER......(seriously, a professional telling people to clean bow hair with toilet bowl cleaner?  What are you thinking?) you will be much better off, and you bow and your playing will benefit.

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13 minutes ago, Jerry Pasewicz said:

Water is a problem.  It can cause deformation of tips causing them to pop off or leaving them permanently deformed, and it can cause cheek cracks as blocks expand... Alcohol can can cause problems as well with finishes and coating the hair with liquid rosin.  The real issue here, is bows need to be rehaired for more reasons than the hair being dirty; in fact it is incredibly rare for that to be the primary reason. As the hair stretches with use, it stretches unevenly which can cause dramatic decreases in performance and even long term damage to sticks that are warped as a result.  Spend the money to have a rehair rather than risk long term damage with alcohol, or TOILET BOWL CLEANER......(seriously, a professional telling people to clean bow hair with toilet bowl cleaner?  What are you thinking?) you will be much better off, and you bow and your playing will benefit.

Sooner or later, one fears, the Europeans will let Americans visit again. You could visit the Rue de Rom where the best French workshops are and watch all the best French bow makers clean bow hair with “cif” (Toilet bowl cleaner) and water. It is a thankless task passing on their trade secrets via Maestronet to some red-neck American mail order bow shop

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I suspect all toilet bowl cleaners are not created equally. :rolleyes:

Check the chemical makeup.

CIF - I can't find a single "toilet bowl cleaner" under this brand, so I can't look up what is in it. Maybe someone can read the label and let us know.  Packaging likely varies between continents.

Maybe it would be less offensive to Jerry if Jacob didn't call it "toilet bowl cleaner", and called it by the chemical(s) name instead? ^_^

*edit:  

Made by Unilever.  Also called Vim or Jif.

I know it as Vim...but I can't find a chemical listing. They really need to make that easy to find - not hard...:angry:

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1 hour ago, jacobsaunders said:

Sooner or later, one fears, the Europeans will let Americans visit again. You could visit the Rue de Rom where the best French workshops are and watch all the best French bow makers clean bow hair with “cif” (Toilet bowl cleaner) and water. It is a thankless task passing on their trade secrets via Maestronet to some red-neck American mail order bow shop

Sure, blame your dipshitery on someone else, why am I not surprised.  How about dealing with your own ignorance and address the problem of how cleaning bow hair doesn’t help worn bow hair?  Better blame it on the French, or your pappy....... take responsibility for yourself.

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4 hours ago, Jerry Pasewicz said:

Water is a problem.  It can cause deformation of tips causing them to pop off or leaving them permanently deformed, and it can cause cheek cracks as blocks expand... Alcohol can can cause problems as well with finishes and coating the hair with liquid rosin.  The real issue here, is bows need to be rehaired for more reasons than the hair being dirty; in fact it is incredibly rare for that to be the primary reason. As the hair stretches with use, it stretches unevenly which can cause dramatic decreases in performance and even long term damage to sticks that are warped as a result.  Spend the money to have a rehair rather than risk long term damage with alcohol, or TOILET BOWL CLEANER......(seriously, a professional telling people to clean bow hair with toilet bowl cleaner?  What are you thinking?) you will be much better off, and you bow and your playing will benefit.

 

4 hours ago, jacobsaunders said:

Sooner or later, one fears, the Europeans will let Americans visit again. You could visit the Rue de Rom where the best French workshops are and watch all the best French bow makers clean bow hair with “cif” (Toilet bowl cleaner) and water. It is a thankless task passing on their trade secrets via Maestronet to some red-neck American mail order bow shop

 

2 hours ago, Rue said:

I suspect all toilet bowl cleaners are not created equally. :rolleyes:

Check the chemical makeup.

CIF - I can't find a single "toilet bowl cleaner" under this brand, so I can't look up what is in it. Maybe someone can read the label and let us know.  Packaging likely varies between continents.

Maybe it would be less offensive to Jerry if Jacob didn't call it "toilet bowl cleaner", and called it by the chemical(s) name instead? ^_^

*edit:  

Made by Unilever.  Also called Vim or Jif.

I know it as Vim...but I can't find a chemical listing. They really need to make that easy to find - not hard...:angry:

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q="cif"+which+is+for+cleaning+the+toilet

“What we've got here is failure to communicate.”  :rolleyes:  Rue nailed the source of friction. 

Jerry, the stuff he probably means is a noncorrosive detergent pump spray cleaner similar to "Formula 409".  He may have it confused with the (also harmless) abrasive cream (under the same brand name) better suited to scrubbing porcelain.

Jacob, when you say "toilet bowl cleaner" over here, what people think of first are products containing corrosives, designed to remove either protein and lipid based gunk with lye, or calcium carbonate based scale with hydrochloric acid, which more accurately might be called "drain cleaners".  Many of these products will attack hair.  :)

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Yes. Do not clean your bow hair. Period. :rolleyes:

...but if you insist - use dish soap and lukewarm water.

Do not use alcohol (too controversial :ph34r: and may damage the finish on your bow)...

...or hydrochloric acid (may eat the entire bow)

...or ammonia

...or bleach

...or lye

...or triethanolamine...

...any others?

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7 minutes ago, Rue said:

Yes. Do not clean your bow hair. Period. :rolleyes:

...but if you insist - use dish soap and lukewarm water.

Do not use alcohol (too controversial :ph34r: and may damage the finish on your bow)...

...or hydrochloric acid (may eat the entire bow)

...or ammonia

...or bleach

...or lye

...or triethanolamine...

...any others?

Definitely keep Nair away from bow hair................  :ph34r:  :lol:

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On 7/20/2020 at 10:57 AM, jacobsaunders said:

I will stick to shampoo thank-you

I would caution about the shampoo one chooses for this purpose. Many shampoos contain oils and other crap that could potentially contaminate the hair. Liquid dish detergent would probably be the safer choice.

Oh dear! The toilet bowl cleaner left my bow hair a psychedelic blue color! What to do...:ph34r:

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10 hours ago, jacobsaunders said:

Sooner or later, one fears, the Europeans will let Americans visit again. You could visit the Rue de Rom where the best French workshops are and watch all the best French bow makers clean bow hair with “cif” (Toilet bowl cleaner) and water. It is a thankless task passing on their trade secrets via Maestronet to some red-neck American ....

What's a toilet?

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Thank you for trying Rue.

Cleaning bow is is not a good thing to do because it is dangerous to the bow and does not have the desired effect of renewing the hair.

Cleaning bow hair with toilet bowl cleaner is not a good thing to do and is monumentally foolish.

Cleaning bow hair with toilet bowl cleaner and suggesting others do it is monumentally foolish and irresponsible.

Cleaning bow hair with toilet bowl cleaner, suggesting others do it, calling people “stupid” that do not use it, and then blaming others for your monumental foolishness and irresponsibility when you get called on it, is despicable.

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