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T Perry / German / Something Else?

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Hi All,

I have been looking into this instrument for a while so I thought I would just get some thoughts from the experts. Do you think this is a T Perry / Wilkinson instrument or something else? (Apologies for the rubbish pictures).

It is definitely quite worn / battered all over, with the painted on purfling which some of the Perry instruments have. It has a very worn Perry Dublin stamp below the button (which seems to be close to the historical examples I have seen), and it looks like there could have been a number marked into the button (too worn to read) which is also something which a lot of the Perry's have. I have looked at the Perry held by the RAM as well as the examples listed on here and I am still unsure. My knowledge is not great so I am sure you will be able to advise of some of the obvious traits of other instrument making traditions / regions that I have not noticed.

There is no makers label.

If you have any thoughts or want any more pictures let me know.

Thanks

 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, zhiyi_zhang617 said:

The scroll, to my untrained eyes, is much more sophisticated thus interesting than the body, isn't it.

I thought the scroll looked like a first time effort. :wacko:

What is "sophisticated" defined as?

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The squarish shoulders and almost parallel f's are very like the Perry illustrated in The British Violin. At auction a few months ago I just missed out (£1500) on a P&W with painted purfling that was pretty similar although in much better condition.

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37 minutes ago, Rue said:

I thought the scroll looked like a first time effort. :wacko:

What is "sophisticated" defined as?

Well, I am not qualified to define "sophisticated" scroll, just might see some resemblance to the scrolls of some old ones of Naples school.

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We need a comprehensive trade dictionary of terms...^_^

Seriously though...it would help. Personal opinions seem to turn discussions into a constant comparison of apples to oranges.

And, I am just on the sidelines, trying to pick up as much as I can...but I find it impossible, especially when all I have to learn from are fuzzy, or distorted, or photos taken from bizzare angles...

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Yes it's a lower range  Perry, I  think. It's had a hard life!

The brand  is  correct,  and I'd be  interested  to  know  the number on the button, which I can't  see clearly on my telephone.  The number would date it to within a year or so. 

The Perry shop produced a great variety of quality,  by several makers, some probably outworkers. I've had one that was almost  certainly  a Mittenwald violin, but to the Perry  templates, so he may have tried having them made abroad, or maybe  a lost  German  rambled into  the  shop. But as I say I've seen  just one of those.

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Hi Conor,

The brand and what appears to be the number is so worn i'm not sure that it can actually be read. I will look at it again and see if I can change the lighting a bit to get a better image.

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That would  be  about 1813 or so. But I can't  really  see the number. 

In my experience these can be a bit of a disaster when you take the lid off and look inside.  We seem to have had many  inventive repairers over the  years,  and  some of their inventions weren't all that  good. 

So I'd be careful  not to invest too much enthusiasm in this old fiddle!

 

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From having a look inside with a very small digital endoscope the back actually looks fine, no cleats or anything that I can see. The top, sides and scroll obviously are not too great.

Just out of curiosity are there any examples of his fathers work in existence and did he use the same brand?

 

 

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It looks like the Perry violins that I see. 

Observations: 1-I don't think that the scroll belongs. 2-If you don't see any cleats that means that all of those cracks are will be in need of some attention. 3-Don't get too excited. It's in pretty bad shape.

I like these, but their highest purpose seems to be as Baroque instruments.

Also, purfling serves a purpose, and when you take these apart, as Connor said, it can be a disaster.

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Don't worry I'm not going to get super excited, I'm just quite happy that it is most likely a Perry. I just see it as a nice piece of history regardless of it's usefulness as a working instrument.

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For me half the fascination of British violins is in their history and the stories of their makers. Somehow Italians don't have the same allure, which is just as well on my budget.

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17 minutes ago, matesic said:

For me half the fascination of British violins is in their history and the stories of their makers. Somehow Italians don't have the same allure, which is just as well on my budget.

Is it PC to call something from Ireland (even if they imported it from Saxony) "British"?

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42 minutes ago, jacobsaunders said:

 

Is it PC to call something from Ireland (even if they imported it from Saxony) "British"?

You're a sh.... disturber are you..:ph34r:

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Ireland is debatably within the British Isles but not part of Great Britain and emphatically not part of Britain.

Sore topic ...

But an Irish violin is deffo not British.

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