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PhilipKT

Juzek Master Art Value?

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Questions like this are usually fruitless because of so many variables, the most important being that the violin in question is not a Juzek Master Art. But I’m asking anyway.

Long story short, among my instruments is a beautiful old violin with a “Made in Czechoslovakia” label. The wood, varnish and workmanship are very much like a Juzek Master Art. My violin friend Suggested that it was probably made in the same factory as the Master Arts, but wasn’t labeled as such because it wasn’t shipped to Metropolitan Music. 

At the VSA convention, I visited the Metro booth and showed photographs to a Juzek descendant. He agreed that the violin probably came from the same factory and was made to the same standards as the master arts, but destined for another location( He also showed me a box of beautiful Violin back wood that looked strikingly like the wood in the photographs. It was so old and so beautifully figured I considered buying some myself even though I have no idea what I would do with it.)

It plays great, and multiple professional colleagues have played it and were enthusiastic about it. But I realize that sound is of little value when determining value, ha ha.

In sum, it is a very well-made older Czech factory Violin, with good wood, two well repaired top cracks, neither in a significant place, and  no other damage.

can the gang suggest a price range?

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Well, Juzek Master Art violins have been the subject of much discussion here on Maestronet, I suggest you do a search.

Given that their only claim to their price tag seems to be the label erroneously claiming that they were made by someone called Juzek, if you take away the label you are left with very little.

A well made Schoenbach trade violin from the early 1920s might be worth about $2000 if it was in excellent condition, but would suffer unduly from any visible restoration. Take off $500 for any label that makes the mistake of mentioning Czecchoslovakia, and a figure of around $1000 seems about right.

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For one of the 1920s, with all the bell's and whistles, probably retail at 8-12K. Probably more for Guarneri and less for the Galgliano (which seem to be more common). I had a Galgliano model in great shape, went for 4500 at auction, had everything, red label, grafted scroll, ebony crown, and great looking wood. 

Given that yours is a "generic", it would probably be less, even if it is just as good.

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56 minutes ago, martin swan said:

Take off $500 for any label that makes the mistake of mentioning Czecchoslovakia

Martin, Czechoslovakia existed as a country basically from 1918-1939, when Germany annexed it( brief pause for some curse words for Neville Chamberlain) so would this violin date from that time? I wouldn’t think there was much exporting to the west during the Cold War.

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Regardless of where they were sourced, authentic "Juzek Master Art" brand violins had some features that distinguished them from regular "Juzek" brand violins such as fine antiquing, ebony crowns on the buttons, grafted necks, finely-carved scrolls, and diamond-shaped brass inlays on the pegs and tailpieces.

So the difference between an authentic "Juzek Master Art" brand violin and other well-constructed Czech instruments is not just the label placed inside. 

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4 hours ago, PhilipKT said:

Long story short, among my instruments is a beautiful old violin with a “Made in Czechoslovakia” label. The wood, varnish and workmanship are very much like a Juzek Master Art. 

I had one like that once. Had the normal Juzek black and white “In Prague” label with grafted scroll, ebony crown, fine wood, etc.  But it didn’t have the brass inserts in the pegs and tailpiece. It was a cannon with very strong projection. Sold it for approx $2k.

”Real” MAs seems to sell for $3k to $4k on eBay and Tarisio and seem to be listed in most shops in the $8k-$10k range (that’s a very unscientific recollection and not guaranteed).

 

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1 hour ago, GeorgeH said:

Regardless of where they were sourced, authentic "Juzek Master Art" brand violins had some features that distinguished them from regular "Juzek" brand violins such as fine antiquing, ebony crowns on the buttons, grafted necks, finely-carved scrolls, and diamond-shaped brass inlays on the pegs and tailpieces.

So the difference between an authentic "Juzek Master Art" brand violin and other well-constructed Czech instruments is not just the label placed inside. 

Yes that’s all true, but the differences you mention are cosmetic( although I’ve never seen one with “antiquing” at least as I understand the term) They are “signature” items designed to set a Juzek MA apart from its non-juzek brethren( or even from its lesser Juzek siblings, for that matter) the wood, construction and varnish appear to be identical.

Edited by PhilipKT
Addendum

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But to be clear, you are asking about a "Made in Czechoslovakia" violin that is not a Juzek or a Master Art Juzek ...? I don't see how it's value relates in any way to the fact that it "looks like a Juzek".

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12 minutes ago, martin swan said:

But to be clear, you are asking about a "Made in Czechoslovakia" violin that is not a Juzek or a Master Art Juzek ...? I don't see how it's value relates in any way to the fact that it "looks like a Juzek".

It certainly does when you are trying to sell one! ;)

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4 minutes ago, Wood Butcher said:

It certainly does when you are trying to sell one! ;)

I have the 30's Metro Music Catalog with Juzek labes, all of the different examples, at the bottoms of the pages...want one?

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Here is an example of a "Juzek Master Art" that is in very fine condition. The "wear" on the instrument is virtually all artificial, and the antiquing, the ebony crown, and neck graft were all designed to make the instrument look older. Overall, the construction is also much nicer than your typical Schoenbach box. 

I don't know if these violins were constructed from the start to be "Juzek Master Art" brand violins or if they were designated after-the-fact from dozens of similar instruments, but this is a very attractive violin and an excellent player.

01front.jpg

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Problem is that everyone claims that their no-name Markie is equal to a Roth, their non-name Frenchie is equal to a CM, and their no-name Chez is equal to a Juzek MA. It could be, but is it really? And unfortunately if it is just as good, the label does mean something.

 

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31 minutes ago, martin swan said:

But to be clear, you are asking about a "Made in Czechoslovakia" violin that is not a Juzek or a Master Art Juzek ...? I don't see how it's value relates in any way to the fact that it "looks like a Juzek".

 The question is based on the fact that the violin appears to be basically the same as a master art, except it doesn’t have the identifying cosmetic features of a master art. Which means it has the same wood, same workmanship varnish and was probably made in the same factory. That means that it is  probably the same quality as a MA. So I was asking if it were possible to place a value on an instrument that looks and plays like a master art, but isn’t one.

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4 minutes ago, PhilipKT said:

So I was asking if it were possible to place a value on an instrument that looks and plays like a master art, but isn’t one.

Martin gave his opinion. I think in my neck of the woods I might say a bit more retail, maybe even 2X or more.

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My pictures are very bad, but here are a couple of photos.

44 minutes ago, martin swan said:

But to be clear, you are asking about a "Made in Czechoslovakia" violin that is not a Juzek or a Master Art Juzek ...? I don't see how it's value relates in any way to the fact that it "looks like a Juzek".

Martin, I’m not trying to be confusing. The violin looked like a master art. It had none of the exterior trappings of a Master Art: But the varnish, the wood, the one piece back looked like a MA. My Violin friend Jay suggested that it was made in the same factory as the master arts.

But because it wasn’t specifically bought by Metropolitan music, it would not have the cosmetic features of a master art. However, it would be essentially the same violin. When I met Adam Juzek at the Metro booth The convention, I showed him the photographs and he agreed. So my question is, if you remove the cosmetic features that define a master art, what might it be worth as just a good solid 20s-30s Czech factory Violin?

 

edit: You have already answered the question, and I am grateful for it, I was just clarifying the question itself, based on your subsequent comment.

Edited by PhilipKT
Edit

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2 minutes ago, PhilipKT said:

The question is based on the fact that the violin appears to be basically the same as a master art, except it doesn’t have the identifying cosmetic features of a master art.

The "Juzek Master Art" is a brand with certain quality expectations. So if it is not a "Juzek Master Art" brand then it is not. What deans said

8 minutes ago, deans said:

Problem is that everyone claims that their no-name Markie is equal to a Roth, their non-name Frenchie is equal to a CM, and their no-name Chez is equal to a Juzek MA.

Here is a nice "Made in Czecho-slowakia" violin that was well-made with excellent wood, etc. but sold for about $1,000. A dealer might have charged twice that.

02top_back2.jpg

03scroll_profile2.jpg

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6 minutes ago, GeorgeH said:

The "Juzek Master Art" is a brand with certain quality expectations. So if it is not a "Juzek Master Art" brand then it is not. What deans said

Here is a nice "Made in Czecho-slowakia" violin that was well-made with excellent wood, etc. but sold for about $1,000. A dealer might have charged twice that.

02top_back2.jpg

03scroll_profile2.jpg

Very nice violin. And that answers the question. Thanks all.

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8 minutes ago, PhilipKT said:

 The question is based on the fact that the violin appears to be basically the same as a master art, except it doesn’t have the identifying cosmetic features of a master art.

 

Lamborghini

Lamborghini-yell.jpg.bfd61de033e7fdb1682c795f641a020e.jpg

 

 

Like a Lamborghini

1704328603_NotaLamborghini.jpg.e50d676ddf8d8d16f6be2c170c752e2c.jpg

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One of the key differences between an old Juzek MA and a high quality but non-MA Czech is the rim of the scroll. Although not all of those MAs have such very deep scooped rims, those made in 1920s tend to have that. Also, MAs, even from the same era, were of great variations in appearance, probably due to the different shops where they were made.

 

IMG_0521.jpg

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