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Need Help identifying vintage violin


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Looks like a Klingenthal model (like the famous Hopf model).

With that, all that one could hope for is narrowing down the age as there were a lot of makers working in a very similar style in the area.

It would originally have had a through-neck which was replaced with a modern neck set. Hence the scroll graft which in this case (as in many other cases) doesn't necessarily mean its very old.

The saddle let into the rib and the centre nick on the back plate one doesn't usually see with the majority of mass produced violins. Maybe it's an early mass produced instrument or just slightly before that.

Nice wood.

 

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 11/15/2019 at 7:31 PM, Guido said:

Looks like a Klingenthal model (like the famous Hopf model).

With that, all that one could hope for is narrowing down the age as there were a lot of makers working in a very similar style in the area.

It would originally have had a through-neck which was replaced with a modern neck set. Hence the scroll graft which in this case (as in many other cases) doesn't necessarily mean its very old.

The saddle let into the rib and the centre nick on the back plate one doesn't usually see with the majority of mass produced violins. Maybe it's an early mass produced instrument or just slightly before that.

Nice wood.

 

Thanks for the information. Would you know an approximate value. Thanks

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16 hours ago, Dads Stuff said:

Would you know an approximate value.

Take it to a local violin dealer and ask them. It is not going to be worth a lot, but value depends of the type: retail value, auction value, wholesale values, local market value, etc.

If you auctioned it on eBay, I'd be surprised if the bidding went over $300. 

What kind of music did your Dad play?

 

 

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9 hours ago, Dads Stuff said:

Thanks for the information. Would you know an approximate value. Thanks

Much depends on the condition which is not necessarily apparent from photos. It also depends on your location and supply and demand in your local market.

I always have a handful of trade instruments available and I spread the price according to condition and relative sound between $500 and $2,000. That would usually be with an all-new set-up though.

If you put it up on ebay you might get $300 or a bit more on a good day. That might be a practical avenue. If you take it to a luthier and he tells you it might be worth $1,500 - $2,000 then that would be after they earned some money for the make-over leaving you with the asset that you might not be able to sell for years at the anticipated value. If you decide to get it into playing condition to maximise what you get for it you should agree with the luthier to take it on commission before he starts to work on it.

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Grafted. (has been a baroque violin and has had the scroll retained, but the neck replaced and modernised - see the joint where the neck goes on to the pegbox and scroll) Pictures 4 and 6.

Nice find. Maybe Hopf, maybe not , but nicer than the  mid/late19th century trade (mass produced) ones, which are plentiful. This quality less so, and of course rather older.

More than 1800 sorted out IMHO.

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17 hours ago, Eryri said:

Grafted. (has been a baroque violin and has had the scroll retained, but the neck replaced and modernised - see the joint where the neck goes on to the pegbox and scroll) Pictures 4 and 6.

 

While I agree that this is nicer and older than most violins that we see made on this model, I wonder what evidence you have for saying this was once a "baroque violin"?

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20 hours ago, Eryri said:

Grafted. (has been a baroque violin and has had the scroll retained, but the neck replaced and modernised - see the joint where the neck goes on to the pegbox and scroll) Pictures 4 and 6.

Nice find. Maybe Hopf, maybe not , but nicer than the  mid/late19th century trade (mass produced) ones, which are plentiful. This quality less so, and of course rather older.

More than 1800 sorted out IMHO.

 

On ‎11‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 8:31 AM, Guido said:

It would originally have had a through-neck which was replaced with a modern neck set. Hence the scroll graft which in this case (as in many other cases) doesn't necessarily mean its very old.

The saddle let into the rib and the centre nick on the back plate one doesn't usually see with the majority of mass produced violins. Maybe it's an early mass produced instrument or just slightly before that.

Nice wood.

I would put it to 1850-70

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On 12/20/2019 at 6:25 PM, martin swan said:

While I agree that this is nicer and older than most violins that we see made on this model, I wonder what evidence you have for saying this was once a "baroque violin"?

So, waffle is it?

Guido, you - or I at any rate - rarely see Hopf type Voigtland violins which have been grafted for that reason, they're usually left alone, but entirely possible. The dropped saddle and nick are a puzzler. Mittenwald does a Hopf model?

Perhaps @jacobsaunders might chip in?

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33 minutes ago, Eryri said:

So, waffle is it?

 

35 minutes ago, Eryri said:

Guido, you - or I at any rate - rarely see Voigtland violins which have been grafted for that reason, they're usually left alone, but entirely possible. 

If that's not waffle I don't know what is - I genuinely have no idea what you're saying. 

Mittenwald doesn't do a Hopf model, but if they did, the notch would be in the rib not on the edge of the back.

 

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On ‎12‎/‎22‎/‎2019 at 5:08 AM, Eryri said:

So, waffle is it?

Guido, you - or I at any rate - rarely see Hopf type Voigtland violins which have been grafted for that reason, they're usually left alone, but entirely possible. The dropped saddle and nick are a puzzler. Mittenwald does a Hopf model?

Perhaps @jacobsaunders might chip in?

Both the saddle (originally let into the rib) and the notch on the back plate are typical of older Voigtland work.

Though-necks are notorious for being all over the place in terms of measurements/specs and have often been replaced.

The graft looks real to me and in fact was the indication for me that the neck was replaced - there is actually no picture showing this.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I am far from a professional, but I have one question to you  regarding the instrument.  Can you read the label fixed to the interior of the instrument?  Not just the name but any and all information regarding the label like a date, any filigree  marking on the label and et.cet.?

Edited by Glock
Typo error
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6 hours ago, Glock said:

Can you read the label fixed to the interior of the instrument?

As you are about to find out on the other thread you started, labels in violins mean just about nothing.  If you post images of your "Stainer," you will find out that it is almost certainly a violin like the one in this thread, made in the German/Czech cottage industry about a century ago.  Seriously, people made whatever fiddle they made, and people selling it stuck in whatever label they had.  Sometimes these are surprisingly nice violins to play, but rarely worth more than a few hundred dollars.  Though, I hope for your sake that somehow you stumbled on a real Stainer, and then all of us can bow down.  Don't hold your breath.

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