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Jeff White

Bow Repair Blownout mortice

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So, what do you all think about using this milling attachment to my MicroMark lathe? It's made for that lathe.  Looks like I could build a little  wood box to fill with something (bondo, dental compound, instamorph)to hold the bow head securely and tighten the box inside the attachment.  Just disappointed it doesn't pivot the angle that faces the chuck.  Jerry, what speed is best for the mill bit?  And, does any type of ball end mill bit work for wood?

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2 hours ago, bengreen said:

I love the concept. Have they held up well in use?

I've only  done a handful  over the  years,  but I've never had one fail.

A George  Darby  violin  bow came in last week with the back broken  out. It has a silver tip, with a couple  of  pins. He left just a few mm behind  the  mortice, and  it lasted for the best part of a century.  It only took one heavy  handed rehair  to  break it. The player loves it, so I'll probably be asked to repair it, and I'll shorten  the mortice a bit if I do.

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5 hours ago, chungviolins said:

How much does this damage/repair affect the value of French bows?

Koo Young 

-72%

That is tongue in cheek, it depends on the bow.

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Conor i think the inner piece has grain perpendicular to the grain of the head? Do you think it adds much strength, as there wouldn`t be much left after cleaning up the mortice.

 

20190810_093717.thumb.jpg.d59a4202f05b5f898f69fb7626800916.jpg

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15 hours ago, chungviolins said:

How much does this damage/repair affect the value of French bows?

Koo Young 

The OP question wasn’t about a „French bow“ but about a Paesold Viola bow. Every blue moon I get the urge to put my businessmans hat on, and wonder what one could charge retail for a Paesold Viola bow with a repaired head, which it still is, however beautifully Butt Joint Jerry has dovetailed it, and can’t help thinking that Jeff’s bow was „totaled“ from the start. Conors George Darby bow probably seems feasable though.

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On ‎8‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 4:47 AM, Conor Russell said:

Here's a  simple way  to tackle  it. I know  that people  may pick holes in it,  but it seems  to  work...

20190810_093610.jpg

20190810_093717.jpg

Conor,

Is this repair done with hand tools? What does the bottom of the perpendicular shim look like? Does it extend past the bottom of the mortise?

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1 hour ago, jacobsaunders said:

The OP question wasn’t about a „French bow“ but about a Paesold Viola bow. Every blue moon I get the urge to put my businessmans hat on, and wonder what one could charge retail for a Paesold Viola bow with a repaired head, which it still is, however beautifully Butt Joint Jerry has dovetailed it, and can’t help thinking that Jeff’s bow was „totaled“ from the start. Conors George Darby bow probably seems feasable though.

 

Well lucky for you your countrymen will support you regardless of how poor of a business man you are.  If this is in fact a "bow" as you describe, "totaled" is just inaccurate....what a surprise that once again you do not know your ass from an eclair....

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19 minutes ago, Jerry Pasewicz said:

Well lucky for you your countrymen will support you regardless of how poor of a business man you are.  If this is in fact a "bow" as you describe, "totaled" is just inaccurate....what a surprise that once again you do not know your ass from an eclair....

Doesn't answer my Question, how much is a Paesold bow with a repaired head worth retail?

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12 minutes ago, jacobsaunders said:

Doesn't answer my Question, how much is a Paesold bow with a repaired head worth retail?

Jacob isn't it best to do research BEFORE you spew worthless opinions?  How about just reading?

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3 hours ago, fiddlecollector said:

Conor i think the inner piece has grain perpendicular to the grain of the head? Do you think it adds much strength, as there wouldn`t be much left after cleaning up the mortice.

 

20190810_093717.thumb.jpg.d59a4202f05b5f898f69fb7626800916.jpg

I don't  think  I  would  have  left quite so little  wood, but it doesn't  take much  to make the  mortice  much  stronger. 

 

1 hour ago, nathan slobodkin said:

Conor,

Is this repair done with hand tools? What does the bottom of the perpendicular shim look like? Does it extend past the bottom of the mortise?

Hi Nathan,

I would  prepare the bottom  of the mortice  to  make it flat when the back was open, and just fit the reinforcement to that surface.  I just use a little  chisel, and a plane to fit the reinforcement. 

20190811_135831.jpg

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14 minutes ago, Conor Russell said:

I don't  think  I  would  have  left quite so little  wood, but it doesn't  take much  to make the  mortice  much  stronger. 

The photo scribling isnt accurate as the bow is yours and i dont know the measurements ,just that 4mm is sort of a standard measurement on many bows from the heel of the head..

Funny how in the 1000`s bows ive had in my possession ive never had a break through yet or needed to do that repair.:)

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4 minutes ago, jacobsaunders said:

Moron

Don't you get tired of behaving like this and just calling people names when you back yourself into a corner?

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I had a few of these come in a couple  of  years ago. Some genius  took up rehairing, and had his day as the best thing since sliced bread. He did a lot of damage - his  repair  was  to flood everything  with superglue - and sometimes  I  was left to do the explaining. One very fine French  bow came  in, and I missed the mess behind  the  head, which had been covered over with muck. It was only when I went to take the hair out that  I realized  the bow was broken, and called the owner. I know  she thinks I broke her bow to this day.

Here's a photo  of  one of those, I cant remember  which.  I always  looked for damage, but now  I  look very carefully!

20170719_114743.jpg

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9 minutes ago, fiddlecollector said:

The photo scribling isnt accurate as the bow is yours and i dont know the measurements ,just that 4mm is sort of a standard measurement on many bows from the heel of the head..

That is pretty accurate.  When Peter Oxley taught at Oberlin last year he had a presentation where he showed one similar  on a french bow....he used a mill from the tip surface for enforcement, so it looked like an elongated "0" ....endgrain side to side.

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16 minutes ago, fiddlecollector said:

 

Funny how in the 1000`s bows ive had in my possession ive never had a break through yet or needed to do that repair.:)

Nor did I until  that lot.

There's  a  YouTube  video of an idiot rehairing  a  bow. He takes the  hair and wedge out of  the  head by grabbing  the  hair with a round nosed pliers, and twisting  it.  That'll do it! I suspect  that my  colleague  learned  from him.

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31 minutes ago, Jerry Pasewicz said:

Conor, to clarify, the end grain is at the left (finger side)and right (thumb side), not the top and bottom?

Yes, side to side.

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24 minutes ago, Jerry Pasewicz said:

Don't you get tired of behaving like this and just calling people names when you back yourself into a corner?

The Paesold bloke comes around almost more often than I would like in a VW bus chock full of Paesold stuff, including more viola bows than you could eat. As such it would be vital to know your retail price for a second hand Paesold viola bow with a repaired head, since there is an unlimited supply of mint new ones. A George Darbey, by contrast is an excelent antique maker, every bit as good as the early Hill bows, which one cannot replace. It isn’t unusual to calculate if repair work is rentable before you start, saves you getting into „Corners“

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