Sign in to follow this  
El Duce

Violin I/d - French or German?

Recommended Posts

Hi Blank face - yes it's getting late now hence the poor light. I had a look at the joints with a magnifying glass but I will check again in daylight to make sure there is nothing there. Thanks again for all your insight. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, martin swan said:

Good to know I haven't challenged some Aldi-shopping pleb to a duel ...

11 is fine by me.

A few months ago I saw Jacob Rees-Mogg in the main Wells carpark at 9am with 2 heavy bags of Waitrose shopping. There were few people around. I was very unsure of my moral duty.

Should I have run him over?

Could you please 'splain the shopping references for us non-Anglophiles? Is this equivalent in the US to shopping at Ralph's vs Whole Foods or Gelson's?  Is Rees-Mogg evil?  The press says he's  "charming." :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Haha

Waitrose is for posh people - the sort of place you can get hand-cut single estate terroir Camembert

Aldi is a kind of food version of Poundland, in which a a 20 kilo bag of frozen chicken wings can be found next to a cut price socket set

Rees-Mogg is evil, a posh Dickensian git , in appearance something akin to a pencil wearing a monocle, who would drive everyone else over a cliff if it would improve the value of his considerable offshore assets.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎12‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 10:46 AM, El Duce said:

Hi I assume this is French but the purfling is thin so just wanted to find out if this throws it into the German camp. Looks well played so I am hoping that is a good sign...albeit with bad bowing!

P1080225.JPG

 

 

 

The belly arching is I think what Michael Darnton is refering to when he talks about the wrong arching that what we see in cheaper Mark/Sc instruments which is quicker and easier to carve than traditional Cremonese arching. Does this affect the tone detrimentally? I will keep an open mind about that.

I assume that this was also used elsewhere but I do get his point. It was surely also used in Mirecourt? My own reference to JB Colin instruments does include this feature. Your instrument jumped out at me as being from the same workshop as mine and I was puzzled also for a while as to whether mine was German or French. But I think it's safe to assume that journeymen influenced some features to add to the confusion?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Blank face said:

I can read all day long Maestronet with my Aldi talk internet flatrate.

How about your meeting with Peter?:ph34r:

Well we met in the Waitrose café and enjoyed a frappacino and a svogliatella and decided to bury the hatchet.

When it came to paying the bill Peter claimed to have forgotten his credit card so the duel is back on ...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, martin swan said:

Well we met in the Waitrose café and enjoyed a frappacino and a svogliatella and decided to bury the hatchet.

I always knew that the Brits are creative to invent odd food and drinks. I also learned that "shitstorm" is a german word creation....-_-

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, Ratcliffiddles said:

Looks pretty standard French to me

Laberte-Humbert workshop?

I would bet Martin a Waitrose Christmas hamper, but he seems to have lost interest, or he's sulking?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't sulk (he said sulkily).

I would be a fool not to pay attention to Peter's opinions, and for me the jury's still out on this violin.

What I took initially to be antiqueing and deliberate varnish wear now looks to me like extreme neglect and real varnish wear. So part of my argument for French has collapsed. The cleats on the back seam also move it west ...

Probably a sharper image of the scroll would clinch it for me.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, martin swan said:

still looking very German to me ...

Martin, may I ask for some reasons? 

What drives me off the German camp is mostly the wear on the varnish. If it is original I have never seen anything like this in MNK. They usually used for simple antiquing Setzerbeize and stomped into the varnish. 

For any doubt I would like to know from the OP if there are pins on the top.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Andreas Preuss said:

Martin, may I ask for some reasons? 

What drives me off the German camp is mostly the wear on the varnish. If it is original I have never seen anything like this in MNK. They usually used for simple antiquing Setzerbeize and stomped into the varnish. 

For any doubt I would like to know from the OP if there are pins on the top.

Yes there does seem to be a single pin under the fingerboard. No pins on the back or front lower block

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, martin swan said:

 

Rees-Mogg is evil, a posh Dickensian git , in appearance something akin to a pencil wearing a monocle, who would drive everyone else over a cliff if it would improve the value of his considerable offshore assets.

"that being said" has anyone ever been able to explain the clothes he's wearing? Why are they always two sizes too big? Is this some secret plot of his equally posh wife to make him look ridiculous?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, El Duce said:

Yes there does seem to be a single pin under the fingerboard. No pins on the back or front lower block

Makes it more likely French. 

Another checkpoint for Markneukirchen work is the joint of the back. Usually it is in the true center with basically zero tolerance. Measured from the outline of the back, French work often has the joint displaced maybe 0.2 - 0.3mm from the true geometrical center. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/21/2018 at 12:50 PM, martin swan said:

JB Colin is a Laberte trade name drummed up to cash in on the success of Collin-Mézin. Violins with this label are very typical Mirecourt productions - here is a nice clean one https://bridgewoodandneitzert.london/product/violin-j-b-colin-mirecourt-1906/

If we study the pegbox, scroll (in particular the pegbox cheeks and the fingerboard platform), corners, arching, varnish treatment, purfling, corners etc etc there really isn't much in common. 

I agree that this is not a JB Collin, the varnish is completly different, and the underground untreated (dirty borwn where the wood comes through). But the fingerboard of the Bridgewood and Neitzert violin is also untypical as Mirecourt makers always rounded the corners of the fingerboard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In my eyes it's still looking like a good german Großstadtgeige imitating the french style in some ways. Otto Seifert comes into my mind, as we discussed the Berliner, but there were a lot of others.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, Blank face said:

In my eyes it's still looking like a good german Großstadtgeige imitating the french style in some ways. Otto Seifert comes into my mind, as we discussed the Berliner, but there were a lot of others.

Hi Blank face thank you - I will have to see what it is like once set up...  A few outdoor shots with better natural light

DSC_0204.JPG

DSC_0205.JPG

DSC_0206.JPG

DSC_0207.JPG

DSC_0208.JPG

DSC_0210.JPG

DSC_0211.JPG

DSC_0212.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.