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Warchal 'Timbre' Strings


JacksonMaberry
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14 hours ago, BassClef said:

Patents protect ideas (inventions, methods, etc.) these have terms which expire. It would take some research to figure out which patents thomastik currently owns and protects and when they expire. Typically companies will continue to make little tweaks here and there and file new patents and always have currently protected patents. So if thomastic owns a valid enforceable patent that covers the construction method or system that it uses to produce strings, in theory DOMS could be violating it, and that is baseless speculation without anything more at this stage.

Copyright protects creativity. Drawings, recordings, etc. so not much in this discussion is protected by copyright. The design of the dominant logo would be protected by copyright (and trademark). Copyright eventually expires but it’s a long time.

Trademark protects the identity of a source of products or services. Basically the brand associated with goods and services sold under it. Trademarks, if maintained, can last forever. Here, Dominant is the trademark at issue, and DOMS or whatever seems like a clear violation of trademark.

Trade secrets are also an important form of IP. I might guess they would be useful in the string industry, but I don't know. It is valuable in many other fields, particularly as patents run out.

https://www.uspto.gov/patents-getting-started/international-protection/trade-secret-policy 

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On 9/22/2018 at 6:24 PM, ClefLover said:

My son wants try some Warchals on one of his cellos, which ones would you suggest?  He currently has Larsen Magnacore and is interested in something similar in sound and response.

I've used Magnacores on my cello and liked them very much. I tried Warchal Brilliant and they didn't suit my cello at all. They were extremely loud (which I didn't mind) but they had an extremely bright (brilliant?) tone that my teacher and I both really disliked. My teacher remarked that if one was playing with an orchestra and needed their sound to cut through, it might be OK, but I didn't want to listen to that every day.  It seems to depend on the cello. My cello sounds good with Helicores, great with Magnacores, mediocre with Spirocores and awful with Warchal Brilliant. Who knows?

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Hi Dimitri,

Thanks for letting me know. Actually, the prototype sent to you is very slightly different. I would guess 4% or so. We are still not sure we will make another "warmer" G, but even if so, it will definitely not be a big difference (otherwise we would get our of intended range).

We have just returned from Cremona. The organizer do not allow entry with instruments to visitors, which makes string trials a bit more difficult. However, a lot of visitors have tried Timbre on two our violin and some of them managed to get their violins in somehow, so they tried them with Timbre too. We got a bulk majority of very positive feedback. To be very precise, there was one lady reporting "too much power" and another one who would like to "get slightly more power". So I believe we have achieved what we aimed. 

However, there is still possibility to customize the set to those having too bright and too dark instrument by making special variations. However, such strategy would increase logistic burden for sellers of course. In any case, let me know please. As I told you, there is a difference that might be, or might not be noticeable according to many other circumstances...

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After thorough testing of the warmer G that Mr. Warchal sent me, I can say the difference is subtle as he predicted.  But the new string really has power (while singing!) in the upper registers.  The original G had a certain instability on the high A on the G (above 1st octave)  and now that’s gone.   I feel in control again on the high G notes   

The string balance is even across strings, and this is definitely a powerful set of strings.  

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  • 2 weeks later...

I received my Warchal Timbre strings a few days ago and installed the A, D and G strings right away. Wonderful tone from the very beginning - but I still kept my Peter Infeld Platinum-plated E string on for the next 2 days. But finally I removed the PI-E and put on the Timbre E - really wonderful string.

I'm really sold on the whole set. I've had this violin since 1951 and it has never sounded better.. I have 3 other violins now and can't wait for my luthier to stock Timbres so I can make it a clean sweep!

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Our strings arrived!

Here is a comparison between the Amber and the Timbre played on a Colin Mezin Le Victorieux by a 13 year old.

Both sets of strings new, barely played in.

To my ear the Timbre sounded clearer and louder.  He preferred the Timbre to the Amber. (Previously Amber was his favourite string.)

Not sure why the Amber recorded louder, turn the volume down on the Amber file when comparing the two.

amber.mp3

timbre.mp3

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11 hours ago, pjham said:

Our strings arrived!

Here is a comparison between the Amber and the Timbre played on a Colin Mezin Le Victorieux by a 13 year old.

Both sets of strings new, barely played in.

To my ear the Timbre sounded clearer and louder.  He preferred the Timbre to the Amber. (Previously Amber was his favourite string.)

Not sure why the Amber recorded louder, turn the volume down on the Amber file when comparing the two.

amber.mp3

timbre.mp3

To my ears, from my speakers, I liked the Amber recording better.  The Ambers seemed to have more overtones and the Timbres seemed somewhat muted, even adjusting volume between the two recordings.  No substitute for hearing it live.  Lots of places between the mic and my speakers for the actual sound to have been changed.  Nice playing by the way.

-Jim

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4 hours ago, Jim Bress said:

To my ears, from my speakers, I liked the Amber recording better.  The Ambers seemed to have more overtones and the Timbres seemed somewhat muted, even adjusting volume between the two recordings.  No substitute for hearing it live.  Lots of places between the mic and my speakers for the actual sound to have been changed.  Nice playing by the way.

-Jim

Thank you.  That was part of one of his grade 8 AMEB pieces.

I will do another recording of the Timbres in a fortnight after both the strings and player have had a chance to acclimatise.  I wonder if he was playing less forcibly since they sounded louder under the ear, although in the room they sounded equally loud from where I sat.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I met @Bohdan Warchal at the Tokyo music fair and he explained me his philosophy of violin sound in connection with making strings. Was very interesting to listen to him and hear him demonstrate what you can do with the new timbre strings. Their sound can be pretty well 'manipulated' for different sound colors. I will try them soon on one of my instruments.

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On 11/3/2018 at 11:08 PM, pjham said:

After two weeks:

He still likes the Timbre better than the Amber to play.

Timbre_2_weeks.mp3

If he likes the Timbers better that's pretty much all that matters.  This recording sounds much like the first Amber recording.  I'm sure he is noticing things under the ear that does not make it to my speakers.

Cheers,

Jim

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  • 3 weeks later...

I finally got around to trying out my trial set of Timbres. I'm embarassingly "stingy" about changing strings, and tend to keep a set on for as long as I can, so I'd been waiting for the strings on one of my better fiddles to go south...So I installed the Timbres on my Alessandro Gagliano and used the fiddle for a series of "L'Histoire du Soldat" performances last week. I like these strings very much, and continue to appreciate Mr. Warchal's approach to string making and the sort of sound profile/response he's going for. Just to be clear, I'm not in any way associated with Warchal and am not receiving anything in compensation for sharing my opinion.

I really fell for the Ambers when they came along, and found they reminded me of the Kaplan and Eudoxa gut core strings I used in my youth. As my violins tend to be on the dark/warm side, after a while I started to feel the Ambers might not be the best choice for my concert work and have been using the two types of Brilliants for most of my instruments the last year or two. (Still using Ambers on the Buchstetter, and the Guadagnini-model viola I made) I was crazy about the helical wound Amber E at first, but I found the normal gauge quite fragile, and gradually started to find I preferred the sound of the plain steel E's I'd been using before.

I find the new Timbres are deep and warm, like the Ambers, but with a stronger bright edge, a nice ringing brilliance. I would make the analogy of comparing Olives to Eudoxas. On my violin all four strings in the trial set work very well. They seem to be thicker gauge than Ambers, but don't feel too ropy or high tension under the fingers or the bow. They seemed to be stretched and "played-in" after 2 days, and the helical "stretch" E seems to be a thicker gauge and perhaps a slightly different composition from the Amber equivalent. It worked well for the Stravinsky where there are quite a few nasty open E-string chords. The tendency to whistle less was appreciated, and I found the sound more to my taste than the Amber E, clearer and more ringing, as opposed to the "fuzzier" almost gut-like sound I felt the Amber E was giving me. I'll keep using the Timbres on this fiddle for the near future. They seem to go together well. As to whether or not I'll put them on other violins I have, I'll see. I'm not particularly dissatisfied with what I'm using on those at the moment. 

For background, I've had this violin for over 15 years, and the strings I've used on it include: Dominants, Infeld Reds, Visions, Corelli Alliances, Eudoxas, Olives, Warchal Ambers, Brilliants and Brilliant Vintages. Before I started using the Warchal Ambers, my favourite set-up on it was an Alliance G, a silver Dominant D, Dominant or Infeld Red A, Corelli plain E. Last year I lent the violin to a young soloist for about a year, and when it came back, it was set-up with a combination of Infelds and Visions with a Kaplan E. When I took it out to play it the first time, I put it right back down because the violin felt and sounded so metallic and harsh. What did that little girl do to my Gagliano! Then I realized she had just put a fresh set of strings on before returning it, and of course, I had forgotten how much Thomastik strings need to "break-in" before they sound decent to my ears. Once broken-in they were fine and I used the fiddle like that for a few concerts over the last few months. I was glad when they started to get worn, though so I could get around to trying the Timbres.

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