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Amadi

interesting old violin, ideas anyone

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Hello, Great quality of input on this site!

This old violin has some nice characteristics, the linings are butted to blocks.There was a reference to Daniel Parker in the case which is lost. Amadi

oldie graft 2.jpg

oldie heel.jpg

oldie inside.jpg

oldie inside1.jpg

oldie inside2.jpg

oldie inside4.jpg

oldie inside 3.jpg

oldie l f.jpg

oldie l scroll.jpg

oldie lining.jpg

oldie r scroll.jpg

oldie top f.jpg

oldieb 1.jpg

oldie back.jpg

oldie block.jpg

oldie button.jpg

oldie f hole.jpg

oldie f scroll.jpg

oldie front.jpg

oldie graft.jpg

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Badly repaired cracks yes.  No back cracks, no sound-post crack and there are worse out there on expensive fiddles well hidden by good restorers.

Edited by Amadi
mistake

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It appears to have pine linings with grain apparent in the back lining. some of front linings seem plain like willow but would have to confirm later. it is dead on 14 inches. Gentle flowing arching.

oldie b arch.jpg

oldie b arch 2.jpg

oldie b scroll.jpg

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I see elegantly mitred blocks that extend into the center bout, an outside mold and purfling that looks nice and cozy lounging in the corners. Is there the chance this could be early to mid 19th century French?

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1 hour ago, martin swan said:

Too many repaired cracks for what?

I presume he was concerned that the cracks would affect the sound quality...

6 hours ago, Amadi said:

Badly repaired cracks yes.  No back cracks, no sound-post crack and there are worse out there on expensive fiddles well hidden by good restorers.

even if, perhaps, he was mistaken in that concern.

Given what the cracks look like from the outside, though, I suspect at least some additional repair work is needed; because it appears to me that the wood on both sides of the crack, in some cases, is not fully joined together. Looking again, though, I'm probably mistaken, only the middle of the belly really looks split, and that could simply be because a dark line hasn't been hidden.

The view of the violin from the back, though, is certainly consistent with the statements by experienced people in the thread that this is a violin of high quality, likely very much well worth purchasing and having repaired. Not that I would have been able to tell it from a cheap violin that happened to have a nice finish.

Edited by Quadibloc
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The scroll bears a resemblance to Richard Duke, which may mean the body is from another violin as it lacks the name "Duke" normally found under the button, although there may be rare examples missing the stamp...................

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

richard duke.jpg

unknown scroll2.jpg

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3 minutes ago, Ratcliffiddles said:

I am pretty sure the op's scroll is not by Richard Duke

As you have ruled out early 18th century, then its not a Parker. If its English as you suggested (did a quick dendro ?) then its a maker is in the latter half of the 18th century. The nearest I could find that had a similar peg hole configuration was Duke. Do you have someone else in mind ?

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Not sure about screw. No thread apparent , 'nail' still in there, looks like its broken off. New neck has little colour  looks like dark staining. 

oldie endpin.jpg

oldie nail.jpg

oldie neck 2.jpg

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21 hours ago, Amadi said:

Not sure about screw. No thread apparent , 'nail' still in there, looks like its broken off. . 

 

oldie nail.jpg

 

The squarish impression appears to be caused by something like a washer underlying a screw, but I could be wrong. Screwed necks were a feature of some english schools, if I'm remembering right.

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37 minutes ago, Blank face said:

The squarish impression appears to be caused by something like a washer underlying a screw, but I could be wrong. Screwed necks were a feature of some english schools, if I'm remembering right.

I thought those old forged nails had square heads sometimes.

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29 minutes ago, Blank face said:

The squarish impression appears to be caused by something like a washer underlying a screw, but I could be wrong. Screwed necks were a feature of some english schools, if I'm remembering right.

Yes, I have read somewhere quite recently about a screw being used rather than nails,  but where it was eludes me. I have taken many screws out of English Georgian furniture and if great care is not taken they tend to shear off. The trick is to first tighten them a half turn and then proceed to unscrew. Nails on the other hand, being malleable iron, have less tendency to snap unless bent back and forth. As this appears to be the original block and is not damaged by removing a nail, my bet would be that it is a broken screw.

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3 minutes ago, Guido said:

I thought those old forged nails had square heads sometimes.


Someone found this one in the river Thames in London while "mudlarking"....................

 

 

nail.jpg

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5 minutes ago, Delabo said:


Someone found this one in the river Thames in London while "mudlarking"....................

 

 

nail.jpg

Nice find!

But if a nail like this was used, the remaining hole should look squarish, too, but it appears to be perfectly round.

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Not all but majority of the forged nails had squre heads in those times. In OP photo there seems to be more like oval shape hole (W-E direction), rather than round. I guess that nail had squered head and rectangele "body?" originaly,  something like 6x3mm at the head, or slightly larger.

When head was forged the material just below the had took slightly oval shape (more rounded on squere nail "body"). You can see that "efect" on many old hand forged nails.

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1 hour ago, Delabo said:

Someone found this one in the river Thames in London while "mudlarking"....................

Did they find the violin that went with it? :)

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Fortunately I don't have to search in the mud to find some well preserved hand forged antique nails in our household ^_^ (but no original screws:().

Without exceptions, the heads are of a very unregular shape with very thin edges which would be surely wrped up while hammering into soft wood. I can't imagine that they could ever leave such a rectangular and deeply impressed mark as visible at the block here.

The "body" at the head seems to be always very broad, which would leave a much bigger hole.

nail forged 1.JPG

nail_forged_2.JPG

nail forged 3.JPG

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