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Hi !

Actually, I'm looking for a 18th century violin with original neck.

I found this one :

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Private-COLLECTION-to-SELL-28-Very-OLD-German-VIOLIN-GEIGE/253771732977

It's not a master violin: purflings seems to be drawn, scroll is not the best I've seen, but looks like to be in original condition.

Just in order to help me, could you date this violin ?

Thank you.

 

 

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I don't think this is 18th century. It looks more like a slightly crude Hopf stye instrument from the early-mid 1800s - they persisted with the "through neck" system much later than other makers.

Nothing wrong with the violin, just not what you are looking for.

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I think it more probably a Salzkammergut violin from the first half of the 19th C. If the fingerboard is made of maple, painted black, and the scroll of beech (neither of which I could conclusively tell from the photos) I would be even more sure of that. As a „baroque“ beginners violin I would find it feasible.

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Without any hesitations, yes ;). I'm 40yr old and I won't buy a painted purflings violin B).

But I agree, he is very very nice. At the moment, it's my favorite one. Just to have an idea, how much this violin should be sold ? I know the price but it's to know if it's reasonable or not.

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On 7/29/2018 at 4:57 AM, Borisravel said:

 I'm 40yr old and I won't buy a painted purflings violin B)..

No problem, kid, that means that the rural benchmade British fiddles I like are safe from your bids, at least until you mature a bit more.   :lol:

Welcome to MN.  We can always use more young people around here.  :)

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It was a joke. But a thrue joke anyway... Lute was my first instrument, there are no lutes with painted rose. I play the early romantic guitar too, there are no romantic guitars with painted purflings... Why is violin a such lawless world ?

A violin maker sales an english one with painted purflings for 3500€. He said it was a very good baroque violin. Why not, but, personnaly, I prefer scottish violins. I know one in mint and original condition, with 18th original case for 7000 E.

Yes, the second violin looks extraordinary early baroque typed. Just for information, it's sold 3500 € too.

Problem to be solved, I've found a 1770 Claude Vuillaume in perfect condition with original neck and fingerboard. And real puflings by the way :).

 

Edited by Borisravel
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9 hours ago, Violadamore said:

No problem, kid, that means that the rural benchmade British fiddles I like are safe from your bids, at least until you mature a bit more.   :lol:

Welcome to MN.  We can always use more young people around here.  :)

Haha!  Thanks for that!  Infinite smiles...

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  • 3 weeks later...

It's branded with false label, but this Label should have be used in Charotte work, so Charotte could have been apprentice in Claude Vuillaume's Workshop

But for the two violinmakers I've seen, no doubt.

Final turn is, effectively a little short but if you look at these auctions:

https://tarisio.com/cozio-archive/browse-the-archive/makers/maker/?Maker_ID=1028

it looks like the third

According to dating of this violin, it's an early Claude Vuillaume (which was born in 1772) and his grand father style is clearly visible. You can see them on Mirecourt museum site.

There are 2 Claude François Vuillaume, it's easy to counfound them.

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All 4 violins on Tarisio look very typical, and all are very similar. None look like your violin really - does it have a certificate? I'm prepared to accept that I may be ignorant, but I would be interested to know who attributed it to Claude Vuillaume. 

Not trying to be tricky, just can't quite see how this bears any resemblance to Claude Vuillaume or any late 19th C French makers, beyond the pointy f-hole tongues. It seems to have super-flat arching, splayed f-holes, and a very un-French scroll ...

Mirecourt violins of this period also unfailingly have a plain dirty yellow varnish, or sometimes brown, but not red over a yellow or golden ground as your violin has.

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I bought this violin to a friend who was a very famous violin maker in Paris. He is now in retirement. I won't gave his name here, but he was very famous and wrote many articles for lutherie books. He still have an impressive collection of famous violins, original baroque guitars, 18th hurdy gurdy. His house is like a museum, but you can play all the instruments you wish.

I saw another violinmaker who said exactly the same thing.

I'll try to have a certificate, but I payed this violin 1000 E and certificate will cost half the price I paied for this violin. So it's not urgent.

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On 7/29/2018 at 9:29 AM, martin swan said:

The first ... I was responding to Jacob's post.

The second looks very nice - is it a problem for you that the purfling is painted? Would you have the same concerns about a Testore for example?

Testore violins would certainly not win any competitions today, and some of the scrolls a re really ugly. Some violas from that family have an amazing sound though. Overall I think many Testore family violins with painted-on purfling are not really nice workmanship.

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40 minutes ago, uguntde said:

Testore violins would certainly not win any competitions today, and some of the scrolls a re really ugly. Some violas from that family have an amazing sound though. Overall I think many Testore family violins with painted-on purfling are not really nice workmanship.

Yuri Bashmet plays on a Testore viola; so does or did Shlomo Mintz on his album of Shostakovich violin / viola sonatas.

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