Guido

Case ID - as the case may be

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13 hours ago, Addie said:

 

IMHO, the OP case has lost its top veneer. :(

Well, It has a more or less intact layer of veneer and I don't think they would veneer over veneer, would they?

Glenn

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Addie, thanks for all the info on the hardware.

I now understand the difference between chest lifts and drawer pulls. It seems that period hardware is a field of study in its own right.

Glenn

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Ditto! :)

I've noticed that difference between handles and pulls on antique items but never actually thought about it.

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I've studied all the examples provided but never seen one exactly like this one - (drawer pull) - that appears on what I believe to be an American case.

I'd love to know if this one (with the bits that peep out beyond the supports), is American or European. Or is it ever possible to say??

Glenn5a7477358c0cc_Handle2.thumb.jpg.24e4a5bead73f91823c627aea935a6d8.jpg

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Because of the "economy of scale" effect, most early American brass hardware was made in Birmingham.

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I don't think that the interior finish of the case is original. The area for the corpus of the violin in green baize may be, but the wall paper I think was added later, and the top and bottom of the inside of the case don't match. If, as I think, this case is mid nineteenth century, by the late 19c the interior might have gotten rather ratty looking and wall paper was a cheap fix.

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8 minutes ago, vathek said:

I don't think that the interior finish of the case is original. The area for the corpus of the violin in green baize may be, but the wall paper I think was added later, and the top and bottom of the inside of the case don't match. If, as I think, this case is mid nineteenth century, by the late 19c the interior might have gotten rather ratty looking and wall paper was a cheap fix.

No.  I think that may well be original, and it was a trend that lasted a long time.  I have an original case that is paper lined.

The paper in the picture does 'match', same pattern in a coordinating colour.  That's not unusual either.  The felt is red as well - all quite deliberate and would have looked rather nice I think, when it was all shiny new.

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2 hours ago, Rue said:

No.  I think that may well be original, and it was a trend that lasted a long time.  I have an original case that is paper lined.

The paper in the picture does 'match', same pattern in a coordinating colour.  That's not unusual either.  The felt is red as well - all quite deliberate and would have looked rather nice I think, when it was all shiny new.

I've seen and handled a lot of 19th. century coffin cases lined with wallpaper, and also feel that this was original.

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Cases, boxes and trunks of all types were commonly paper lined, from the 18th c. to the end of the 19th c.

Plain indigo blue paper was common in England and America before c. 1850.

I'm not sure when felt replaced green baize as the universal utility fabric.

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4 hours ago, Rue said:

No.  I think that may well be original, and it was a trend that lasted a long time.  I have an original case that is paper lined.

The paper in the picture does 'match', same pattern in a coordinating colour.  That's not unusual either.  The felt is red as well - all quite deliberate and would have looked rather nice I think, when it was all shiny new.

I tend to agree. Wallpaper long and a bit of felt for the corpus was quite common and, as these things go, the quality on this one is slightly above average.

The difference in shade between the inner lid and the lower part could be due to accumulation of rosin and dirt.

The biggest puzzle is why there is no spinner or other means to attach a bow or two inside the lid.

Glenn

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On 1/28/2018 at 2:02 AM, Guido said:

Would anyone want to venture a guess as to the age and origin of this case?

IMG_1812.JPG

IMG_1813.JPG

IMG_1814.JPG

IMG_1815.JPG

IMG_1816.JPG

 

Update:  Now I have had the opportunity to study this case at close quarters and carry out some much needed conservation work, I have completely changed my opinion about it.

The hand blocked paper lining, weave of the cloth and type of early machine made screws lead me to a date in the English  Regency period 1810 - 1840. The general aesthetic of veneers with real ebony edges correspond to trinket boxes and tea caddies of this era also. In summary, a fascinating late Georgian survivor.

Glenn

 

Georgian case restored.jpg

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3 hours ago, Violadamore said:

Thanks, Glenn.  You do lovely work on wood as well as paper.  :)

 

Thanks.

Interesting you mention wood - it polished up nicely but I still don't know what it is. I'll post more pics of it in the hope someone might recognise it.

Glenn

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2 hours ago, GlennYorkPA said:

 

Thanks.

Interesting you mention wood - it polished up nicely but I still don't know what it is. I'll post more pics of it in the hope someone might recognise it.

Glenn

Here are better pics of the veneer? Any ideas?

Glenn

wood_+_escutcheon.jpg

wood_+_handle.jpg

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23 hours ago, GlennYorkPA said:

Here are better pics of the veneer? Any ideas?

Glenn

wood_+_escutcheon.jpg

wood_+_handle.jpg

What an amazing job. I'm so glad the case has found the best possible home in the world. I think I would have never gotten around to do anything with it and proabbly just pushed it around forever.

Regarding the wood, someone mentioned satinwood before. I just came across a Hill bow case in satainwood that looked similar - at least the color at a casual look. Unfortunately, the book is with a friend I can't take a closer look right now. But I assume you would have recognised if it was satainwood anyways?

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Guido,

This case definitely doesn't have a satinwood veneer but I'm definitely curious to hear about the Hill bow case you came across. They are as rare as hen's teeth.

Here is a Hill satinwood violin case showing the typical figuring of trees  from East Bengal. I think from western India they have less figure but I'm inclined to think your case is an English wood such as Ash or Elm.

Glenn

 

Closed Sm1.jpg

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"......early machine made screws lead me to a date in the English  Regency period 1810 - 1840."    Not really a case question, Glenn, but what do you find distinctive about the screws?  Have you pulled anything similar out of other datable cases?

Richard

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7 hours ago, Richf said:

"......early machine made screws lead me to a date in the English  Regency period 1810 - 1840."    Not really a case question, Glenn, but what do you find distinctive about the screws?  Have you pulled anything similar out of other datable cases?

Richard

 

Richard, The history of screws is very interesting.

I firmly believe that if Stradivari had ready access to screws he would have used them to attach his necks to the rib garland instead of nails.

Before 1760, screws were hand made and the threads done with a file. The first machine to make screws was patented in England in 1760,

c. 1820, screws were made from a drawn rod so one can see longitudinal stripes on the shank. Screws turned on a lathe have circumferential marks on the shank and modern ones are smooth on the shank. It's a complex topic but screws can be dated from such things as the type of slot, the profile of the thread cuts, the taper and a few other factors. 

In general, hardware is the most accurate way of dating cases or any antique furniture.

Glenn

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