mapfluke Posted January 15, 2018 Report Share Posted January 15, 2018 I have recently decided that the process of violin making and repairing is something I may want to do as a career for the working part of my life (and as a hobby for the rest of it). However, I am only a Junior in High School so that is subject to change. But I was wondering if anyone had recommended schools for violin making and repairing that I would want to attend after graduating High School. I find myself reading many threads on this website and losing track of time very easily, especially when I work on little things on my own violin. I want to learn so much more about this art and I am thinking about applying to work at my local violin shop to learn the basics over the next two summers to prepare myself. Any input is greatly appreciated and any other suggestions will be taken into consideration. Thank you all very much as I am so glad I found this site just a little less than a year ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASEWICZ Posted January 15, 2018 Report Share Posted January 15, 2018 10 minutes ago, mapfluke said: I have recently decided that the process of violin making and repairing is something I may want to do as a career for the working part of my life (and as a hobby for the rest of it). However, I am only a Junior in High School so that is subject to change. But I was wondering if anyone had recommended schools for violin making and repairing that I would want to attend after graduating High School. I find myself reading many threads on this website and losing track of time very easily, especially when I work on little things on my own violin. I want to learn so much more about this art and I am thinking about applying to work at my local violin shop to learn the basics over the next two summers to prepare myself. Any input is greatly appreciated and any other suggestions will be taken into consideration. Thank you all very much as I am so glad I found this site just a little less than a year ago. Where do you live mapfluke? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mapfluke Posted January 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2018 Just now, Jerry Pasewicz said: Where do you live mapfluke? Upstate New York but anywhere in the United States is okay with me when it comes to the location of the school, I am very willing to travel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duane88 Posted January 15, 2018 Report Share Posted January 15, 2018 I went to the school in Salt Lake City. There are schools in Boston at the North Bennett Street School and in Chicago. There are others that will be mentioned, as well. When I was looking and considering, a well established member of the trade who had a shop where I was living suggested that he thought that I could have/get a good experience at any of the then three primary schools. Indiana has a minor in violin making, so a degree from a "real" school could be had. Don't overlook the shop education route. The key is to bug someone just enough that they teach you, but not so much that they ban you from their shop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mapfluke Posted January 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 Just now, duane88 said: I went to the school in Salt Lake City. There are schools in Boston at the North Bennett Street School and in Chicago. There are others that will be mentioned, as well. When I was looking and considering, a well established member of the trade who had a shop where I was living suggested that he thought that I could have/get a good experience at any of the then three primary schools. Indiana has a minor in violin making, so a degree from a "real" school could be had. Don't overlook the shop education route. The key is to bug someone just enough that they teach you, but not so much that they ban you from their shop! I've looked into the VMSA in Salt Lake City, definitely an option. And I have just the local shop in mind to do exactly as you stated at the end Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASEWICZ Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 minute ago, mapfluke said: Upstate New York but anywhere in the United States is okay with me when it comes to the location of the school, I am very willing to travel Yes, you will have to. I was asking so I can suggest which of our colleagues are close enough for you to visit and find out what you are getting into. Have a look at this website and plug in your location under “member list”, and then location. http://www.afvbm.org/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nathan slobodkin Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 Although I was lucky enough to get a good education through an apprenticeship I would say that working in a violin shop does not necessarily translate into training as a violin maker. I would recommend graduating from a good violin making school and then getting a job in the best shop you can find to learn repair, restoration and the business in general. This is a very complicated business and you will eventually need to specialize as a maker, shop owner, restorer or expert. Whichever you choose solid, basic training in making instruments will be a firm foundation. Most of the violin making schools are very small and may only have one or two teachers so you should really be looking at the teacher you want to work with rather than just the school. Right now Roman Barnas at North Bennett street in Boston is very good as is Brian Derber in Wisconsin. Other people may know the teachers at some of the other schools but those two are the one's I know and think highly of. The last word of advice I would give you is to look carefully at the realities of making a living in the violin making profession. As I said, it's complicated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Dorsey Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 mapfluke, There are two things you can start working on now to prepare yourself: 1. Learn to play the violin as well as you can. This will enable you to assess instruments from a player's perspective. Try playing as many different instruments as you can. When you encounter ones that seem easier/harder to play, or ones that sound better/worse, try to figure out why. 2. Acquire tool skills. Any manual skills can help, but learning to use and maintain hand woodworking tools will be the most useful. If your school offers shop classes, take them. Even metalworking skills can be useful. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chungviolins Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 New world school by Brian Derber. https://newworldschool.cc/contact-us/ Highly recommend him, he is a good friend of mine and he was my teacher when I was in school. If you have a chance to learn how to use a block plane, that will be great help. It takes years to use it properly, learn how to sharpen etc. KYC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Cossmann Cooke Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 Be prepared to visit the schools, talk to instructors, students and former students. In the latter case, ideally folks who have been in the workforce for a short period as well as those who have a lot of experience under their belts. You want an idea of what life is like just out of school and what it can become down the road. If you're going to spend three + years there, that is a worthwhile investment of time and money. Consider other factors beyond the schools themselves -- cost of living, opportunities provided by the surrounding communities. Your nose will be to the grindstone, but all work and no play makes for a lesser luthier. Or anything else, for that matter. Be open to the likelihood you will work in a shop doing repairs, set-ups, eventually restorations and making at best will be a sideline. Very few are lucky enough to be able to make a living making instruments (not that it's about luck; I should say "fortunate"). Nothing at all wrong with working in a shop as a career. Just that it's easy to view that as second-best if you go into training thinking you are going come out the other end a maker. Be realistic about what you will emerge with when you finish a school program. Repair and set-up experience are not the major emphases at a lot of the schools. Then again, you will not be a maker when you graduate either. You will have some tool skills, know how to sharpen (you BETTER know how!), and maybe know what you don't know, but the learning will only just have begun. Take advantage of any flexibility you have now to attend a one- or two-week summer program somewhere and get a hands-on sense of what the work is like when you are doing it 8 hours a day. None of which is intended to discourage you in any way. And if none of it does, then you are one step closer to knowing that this is indeed something you want to do. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Bress Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 47 minutes ago, Julian Cossmann Cooke said: Be prepared to visit the schools, talk to instructors, students and former students. In the latter case, ideally folks who have been in the workforce for a short period as well as those who have a lot of experience under their belts. You want an idea of what life is like just out of school and what it can become down the road. If you're going to spend three + years there, that is a worthwhile investment of time and money. Consider other factors beyond the schools themselves -- cost of living, opportunities provided by the surrounding communities. Your nose will be to the grindstone, but all work and no play makes for a lesser luthier. Or anything else, for that matter. Be open to the likelihood you will work in a shop doing repairs, set-ups, eventually restorations and making at best will be a sideline. Very few are lucky enough to be able to make a living making instruments (not that it's about luck; I should say "fortunate"). Nothing at all wrong with working in a shop as a career. Just that it's easy to view that as second-best if you go into training thinking you are going come out the other end a maker. Be realistic about what you will emerge with when you finish a school program. Repair and set-up experience are not the major emphases at a lot of the schools. Then again, you will not be a maker when you graduate either. You will have some tool skills, know how to sharpen (you BETTER know how!), and maybe know what you don't know, but the learning will only just have begun. Take advantage of any flexibility you have now to attend a one- or two-week summer program somewhere and get a hands-on sense of what the work is like when you are doing it 8 hours a day. None of which is intended to discourage you in any way. And if none of it does, then you are one step closer to knowing that this is indeed something you want to do. Good luck! Julian, You said as much to me in person, and others have told me a similar tale. Some part of me still thinks that one should be able to come out of three years of focused study with much more. I guess that's what you mean by realistic expectations. I've never been very good with realistic or even reasonable expectations. -Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Holmes Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 In addition to the advice you have been, and wii be, be offered by other members on the board: The network obtained from attending one of the established schools can be a valuable asset... and one that can be expanded over one's career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle duke Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 5 hours ago, chungviolins said: New world school by Brian Derber. https://newworldschool.cc/contact-us/ Highly recommend him, he is a good friend of mine and he was my teacher when I was in school. If you have a chance to learn how to use a block plane, that will be great help. It takes years to use it properly, learn how to sharpen etc. KYC Couldn't Mapfluke just purchase a Bruce Ossman violin making book instead of school? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chungviolins Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 Study hard , go to college, get a good paying job, then do making violins as hobby, you will be much happier later. KYC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Cossmann Cooke Posted January 16, 2018 Report Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 hours ago, Jeffrey Holmes said: In addition to the advice you have been, and wii be, be offered by other members on the board: The network obtained from attending one of the established schools can be a valuable asset... and one that can be expanded over one's career. Hear hear! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phutatorius Posted January 17, 2018 Report Share Posted January 17, 2018 5 hours ago, chungviolins said: Study hard , go to college, get a good paying job, then do making violins as hobby, you will be much happier later. KYC Given the reality of student debt, I wonder how practical this advice really is to get a degree just for the sake of a degree. Instead, I'd endorse Brad Dorsey's advice above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Allen Posted January 17, 2018 Report Share Posted January 17, 2018 My friend is $120,000 in the hole from college. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mapfluke Posted January 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2018 11 hours ago, Brad Dorsey said: mapfluke, There are two things you can start working on now to prepare yourself: 1. Learn to play the violin as well as you can. This will enable you to assess instruments from a player's perspective. Try playing as many different instruments as you can. When you encounter ones that seem easier/harder to play, or ones that sound better/worse, try to figure out why. 2. Acquire tool skills. Any manual skills can help, but learning to use and maintain hand woodworking tools will be the most useful. If your school offers shop classes, take them. Even metalworking skills can be useful. Good luck. Currently, I have been playing as the first-chair cellist in my High School orchestra and I am just about 9 months into learning violin (which I am loving by the way). Let's not talk about viola just yet So it's mostly working on step two and I've got two years I'm going to be spending at the local violin shop to learn as much as I possibly can. I'm also looking into squeezing a woodworking class into my senior year of High School so I can only hope that can happen. Thank you for your advice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mapfluke Posted January 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2018 6 hours ago, chungviolins said: Study hard , go to college, get a good paying job, then do making violins as hobby, you will be much happier later. KYC I've been thinking if getting an associates degree in something like business management, or something broad that can be applied to many situations, at a local community college which I would only have to attend for one year because of how many credits I am graduating High School with as they would transfer over. Wondering if that's a good idea or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mapfluke Posted January 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2018 8 hours ago, Julian Cossmann Cooke said: Be prepared to visit the schools, talk to instructors, students and former students. In the latter case, ideally folks who have been in the workforce for a short period as well as those who have a lot of experience under their belts. You want an idea of what life is like just out of school and what it can become down the road. If you're going to spend three + years there, that is a worthwhile investment of time and money. Consider other factors beyond the schools themselves -- cost of living, opportunities provided by the surrounding communities. Your nose will be to the grindstone, but all work and no play makes for a lesser luthier. Or anything else, for that matter. Be open to the likelihood you will work in a shop doing repairs, set-ups, eventually restorations and making at best will be a sideline. Very few are lucky enough to be able to make a living making instruments (not that it's about luck; I should say "fortunate"). Nothing at all wrong with working in a shop as a career. Just that it's easy to view that as second-best if you go into training thinking you are going come out the other end a maker. Be realistic about what you will emerge with when you finish a school program. Repair and set-up experience are not the major emphases at a lot of the schools. Then again, you will not be a maker when you graduate either. You will have some tool skills, know how to sharpen (you BETTER know how!), and maybe know what you don't know, but the learning will only just have begun. Take advantage of any flexibility you have now to attend a one- or two-week summer program somewhere and get a hands-on sense of what the work is like when you are doing it 8 hours a day. None of which is intended to discourage you in any way. And if none of it does, then you are one step closer to knowing that this is indeed something you want to do. Good luck! Thank you very much, this is very informative and will be put to good use! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mapfluke Posted January 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2018 11 hours ago, chungviolins said: New world school by Brian Derber. https://newworldschool.cc/contact-us/ Highly recommend him, he is a good friend of mine and he was my teacher when I was in school. If you have a chance to learn how to use a block plane, that will be great help. It takes years to use it properly, learn how to sharpen etc. KYC I may schedule a visit this summer, any message(s) you would like me to deliver? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phutatorius Posted January 17, 2018 Report Share Posted January 17, 2018 An economical associates degree isn't a bad idea. When I was 50 (20 years ago) I dropped about $50,000 on a law degree and then hated the practice of law. I wished I'd spent that money on a violin making school instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chungviolins Posted January 17, 2018 Report Share Posted January 17, 2018 4 hours ago, mapfluke said: I may schedule a visit this summer, any message(s) you would like me to deliver? mapfluke, say hi for me and tell him KYC sent you. KYC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unh-luthier Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 You might also want to consider an introductory summer program. The University of New Hampshire offers a summer luthier program that has been running for more than 45 consecutive years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Holmes Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 On 1/15/2018 at 8:49 PM, nathan slobodkin said: Most of the violin making schools are very small and may only have one or two teachers so you should really be looking at the teacher you want to work with rather than just the school. Right now Roman Barnas at North Bennett street in Boston is very good as is Brian Derber in Wisconsin. Other people may know the teachers at some of the other schools but those two are the one's I know and think highly of. FYI: https://www.thestrad.com/news/antoine-nedelec-named-director-of-chicago-school-of-violin-making/8367.article Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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