Ratcliffiddles

Messiah wood (again....)

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Hi all,

I have made a short documentary about the wood of the Messiah violin and what the cross-matching tests have exposed.

I hope you enjoy it as much as I enjoyed producing it!

It is not quite the final version as I am still waiting for a couple of photographs.

Peter

 

            

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Peter thank you very much for taking the time to make this presentation. I think it will be helpful explaining the basis for the findings, which statistically seem quite air tight.

What you need to do now is market a "violin dendro dna kit" that can be sold online. That way people can dendro their own violins then send you the data in the hopes of finding something that may be attributed to a great maker or wood supplier to a great maker:)  and at the same time increases the data base for violins specifically.

 

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Peter,  This is a wonderful presentation and it's nice to have a face to go with your Maestronet ID.

I do have one slight criticism.  It would have been better for me without music playing while you speak.  I love the music that you used -- to the point that I had difficulty following what you say because the music took me to a different state of mind.  Perhaps I am an anomaly, but I often find music playing in the background behind a speaker to be a distraction.

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1 hour ago, Brad Dorsey said:

Peter,  This is a wonderful presentation and it's nice to have a face to go with your Maestronet ID.

I do have one slight criticism.  It would have been better for me without music playing while you speak.  I love the music that you used -- to the point that I had difficulty following what you say because the music took me to a different state of mind.  Perhaps I am an anomaly, but I often find music playing in the background behind a speaker to be a distraction.

I agree. But Many many thanks, really great work done! 

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1 hour ago, Brad Dorsey said:

Peter,  This is a wonderful presentation and it's nice to have a face to go with your Maestronet ID.

I do have one slight criticism.  It would have been better for me without music playing while you speak.  I love the music that you used -- to the point that I had difficulty following what you say because the music took me to a different state of mind.  Perhaps I am an anomaly, but I often find music playing in the background behind a speaker to be a distraction.

I had similar thoughts. When there is good-quality music going on, I tend to focus on that.

At the same time, when I imagined the narrative without the music, it might have been lacking something. I think you made a really nice compromise by lowering the volume of the music when you were speaking, at least some of time. (I didn't go back to check how often it was done.)

15 minutes ago, mathieu valde said:

I agree. But Many many thanks, really great work done! 

Yes!

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Peter, just a question about dendro, and particularly this instrument.  Do you make a point of analyzing more than one line of annual growth rings across a spruce top?  You clearly do the bass and treble side separately, but it would seem that there is a big opportunity to take several passes at different points on the belly to see if you still have good correlation.  I've never been directly involved, but I know that on at least some instruments the widths between annual rings can vary depending on where the 'slice' is measured. 

Given the amount of controversy on this instrument, perhaps it's partly related to where on the belly the measurements were taken on the various dendro tests?  Did you perhaps compare your profiles to the earlier ones taken by others?  Not doubting the quality of your work, just also wondering how their profiles would match up to the better databases of today.  You don't need to answer all my questions!  :lol:

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Hi Peter,

found the time this morning to watch the video. Both great information and entertainment! I like all the picture motives as well as the music (it's somehow humorous to choose Händel, I guess intentional). Maybe you missed a career as a scientifical TV speaker?;) Thanks a lot!

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Peter, 

I know we've spoken (I even got to see the preview without Handel all over it -it's better with, whatever Brad has to say!) - but this is really great. What I'm really grateful about is that you draw to the surface many of the critical elements of the dendrochronological technique that get buried in a densely written scholarly article, so it's really wonderful to see the facts brought out in a clear and approachable way in order to allow for an understanding that can be backed up - if need be - by furrowing in the academic journals. 

Its really helpful to have something out there to direct people to who have seen some of the ill-seated speculation. Thanks again!

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Thank you Peter! Masterful job.

Peter, recently I’ve been having a conversation with a very knowledgable leading American concertmaster on violinists and their their violins. It is a discussion about the affinity between players and the sound of the particular instrument they chose. My question for you, seeing that you have cross referenced the the tops of Stradivari’s violin’s to the trees they were made from, is if there were particular logs that produced tonally superior instruments or instruments of recognizable tonal characteristics? 

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Peter, a very interesting presentation. I can't even begin to appreciate the time and effort you have in your research. The photography in the Alpine region was absolutely stunning!

I too found the background music to be something of a distraction;  for someone unfamiliar with details of your work, it becomes more difficult to focus and absorb the information. In my opinion, I would fade it out entirely during the monologue.

Thank you for presenting this.

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Thanks for the comments. 

Sorry about the music, it was my first attempt at a video, and this wasn’t picked up by the reviewers, but will bear it in mind for future clips.

I would love to hear about people who have alternative scenarios in view of the cross-matching results. And yes, I have already thought about the fact that the treble side of the 1724 Ex Wilhelmj could have been made by Vuillaume as a repair, and that the matching instruments could all be fakes, of course, by Vuillaume as well...

For those of you who did not attend the Oxford conference, I think Bruce Carlson’s presentation, especially dealing with the comparative constructional methods, between Stradivari’s instruments and Vuillaume’s was very revealing. This revealed that although Vuillaume copied the visual internal characteristics, some specific, small details betray a different, French method of construction on his instruments, which are never seen on Stradivari’s violins.  

 

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It is in excellent presentation.

I found the music from the Messiah a clever joke, though if done with a lighter touch there would be less interefence with speech for those who don't hear too well.

What a wonderful opportunity there is here! Maybe the next stage is to design a smarphone app. Instrument and timber dealers and buyers, and perhaps building surveyors, can with the smarphone camera  (a) collect wood data from violins of probable geographical provenance, date, and where possible a known workshop, and send it to the cloud to a growing copy of the data set; and (b) for violins or other wood samples of unknown provenance sends back a list of possible wood date, wood provenance, and where possible matches with instrument makers or workshops, each with a probability score.

Such software exists already in commercial apps for flower identification, face recogntiion, etc. The problem is evaluating the incoming training data, and working out how to grow a reliable data set efficiently. One approach is to ask users to accept or reject a proposed identification of date, region, workshop. Whether that approach could build good training data is the question.

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3 hours ago, Ratcliffiddles said:

Thanks for the comments. 

Sorry about the music, it was my first attempt at a video, and this wasn’t picked up by the reviewers, but will bear it in mind for future

 

clips.

 

Thanks Peter. Excellent presentation. The music didn't put me off. Do I detect a bit of German in your accent also?

 

3 hours ago, Ratcliffiddles said:

I would love to hear about people who have alternative scenarios in view of the cross-matching results. And yes, I have already thought about the fact that the treble side of the 1724 Ex Wilhelmj could have been made by Vuillaume as a repair, and that the matching instruments could all be fakes, of course, by Vuillaume as well...

For those of you who did not attend the Oxford conference, I think Bruce Carlson’s presentation, especially dealing with the comparative constructional methods, between Stradivari’s instruments and Vuillaume’s was very revealing. This revealed that although Vuillaume copied the visual internal characteristics, some specific, small details betray a different, French method of construction on his instruments, which are never seen on Stradivari’s violins.  

 

Did Vuillaume have access to these two logs you mention? There are some interesting variations in the f holes, in these instruments, that make me wonder. I'm open to any well informed opinion from you or Bruce or anyone else?

 

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46 minutes ago, sospiri said:

 

Did Vuillaume have access to these two logs you mention? There are some interesting variations in the f holes, in these instruments, that make me wonder. I'm open to any well informed opinion from you or Bruce or anyone else?

 

If he did, I haven't come across them yet. You can be sure that I would have said if I had!

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