Jump to content
Maestronet Forums

Baroque violin tailpiece, nut, tailgut?


maxr
 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 82
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

1 hour ago, Borisravel said:

You're lucky to be not too fussy :).

My research was a baroque violin with original neck and fingerboard and it was not easy to find.

I agree it's difficult to find authentic and original accessories.

What drove your project and research? Was it your own interest or pressure from a client?

I only ask because I am neither a dealer, restorer nor professional musician and yet I feel the urge to do the best for instruments in my care. I'm very interested in your experience installing a baroque tailpiece because I am currently conflicted between restoring my 1774 Thomas Perry violin to original appearance and possibly detracting from the wonderful performance characteristics it has now with the Hill tailpiece.

Glenn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mine is simpler - I got hold of a ca. 1800 Hopf with original neck. The fingerboard was completely worn out, and has been replaced with a nice maple one. I may change it to something else next time, maybe hazel? The tailpiece is next, now it has an «old modern» one with MOP inlay It sounds good with gut strings as it is.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Violin is for me a reconversion instrument. I fall into early music when I was very young as organist and lutenist. I'm an early music extremist and I assume it, that's why I was looking for a such instrument.

But in fact, there are not so many differences between modern and baroque violin and the biggest difference is the bow and right hand technique. Restoring your violin in his orignal condition won't give him back his original neck.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Felefar said:

Mine is simpler - I got hold of a ca. 1800 Hopf with original neck. The fingerboard was completely worn out, and has been replaced with a nice maple one. I may change it to something else next time, maybe hazel? The tailpiece is next, now it has an «old modern» one with MOP inlay It sounds good with gut strings as it is.

I think it's an error to use maple as fingerboard. Maple is heavy and lightness is the goal of a baroque violin. original fingerboards are often from light and white woods with a thick veneering.

If you don't use any chinrest, you'll feel a big difference between a veneered and a solid fingerboard.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Felefar said:

Mine is simpler - I got hold of a ca. 1800 Hopf with original neck. The fingerboard was completely worn out, and has been replaced with a nice maple one. I may change it to something else next time, maybe hazel? The tailpiece is next, now it has an «old modern» one with MOP inlay It sounds good with gut strings as it is.

Gut strings require more tuning than modern strings because they are sensitive to humidity changes and stretching. How much of a nuisance is this and are fine tuners useful?

Glenn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, GlennYorkPA said:

Gut strings require more tuning than modern strings because they are sensitive to humidity changes and stretching. How much of a nuisance is this and are fine tuners useful?

Glenn

My guy strung Baroque setup fiddle has Wittner geared pegs fitted. I find them really useful for frequent retuning. I don't think fine tuners have the range of tuning require for plain gut strings, especially a new set.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, maxr said:

My guy strung Baroque setup fiddle has Wittner geared pegs fitted. I find them really useful for frequent retuning. I don't think fine tuners have the range of tuning require for plain gut strings, especially a new set.

My wife is a professional baroque player, and swears by wittners for playing gut. Not exactly "Historically Appropriate", but it works for her. She's always the first one tuned, and touching up the tuning mid performance is very vast and exceedingly discreet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Borisravel said:

You can't undestand baroque music if you play on modern strings.

That's quite a sweeping statement, Boris. Many of the great soloists of 20th C played Baroque music on modern strings, even if they were wound gut?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, maxr said:

That's quite a sweeping statement, Boris. Many of the great soloists of 20th C played Baroque music on modern strings, even if they were wound gut?

Yes and I assume it.

But first, don't forget that he great soloists of 20thc played on gut strings and very moderate tension until 1950 and maybe later.

And second a baroque player is someone who plays with an historically enlightened style, and not only with play baroque scores with a modern violin or only a baroque bow. For me, a baroque player is someone who spend much time in research in libraries and time with his violin.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, maxr said:

My guy strung Baroque setup fiddle has Wittner geared pegs fitted. I find them really useful for frequent retuning. I don't think fine tuners have the range of tuning require for plain gut strings, especially a new set.

I've never taken the plunge to install Wittner pegs but you make a good point to use them with gut strungs. Do they need to be professionally fitted or can anyone do it?

Glenn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, GlennYorkPA said:

I've never taken the plunge to install Wittner pegs but you make a good point to use them with gut strungs. Do they need to be professionally fitted or can anyone do it?

Glenn

Glenn, given your experience I suspect you could fit a set of wittners no problem. It's really not unlike fitting a set of conventional pegs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Borisravel said:

What is the problem with conventional pegs ?

 

The problem is that they were invented in the relatively gentle climate of Northern Europe. 

Here in Pennsylvania we are subject to great and rapid changes in temperature and, more importantly, humidity. Short of cocooning oneself in museum-like climate control, conventional pegs are a constant nuisance. The problem applies to most antiques made of natural materials which routinely crack and also our bodies. I need to baste myself with oils in the winter to calm the dry itching resulting from low humidity.

I'm instinctively aversed to Wittner pegs but can't help feeling that somethings, including peg design, should have evolved over the last 400 years even if the violin itself has not.

Glenn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Borisravel said:

I'm French. Last week, in my house, it was 40% of humidity, today, it's 72% and I live in a old house with more than 40cm thickness walls. The problem with pegs is not material itself, the problem comes from the fact that modern pegs should absolutely made of ebony or rosewood instead of boxwood or fruit trees.

:)

And yet, as Eric Meyer pointed out, box and fruitwoods were the original woods of choice so even ebony and self lubricating rosewood are evolutionary developments. 

But another part of the problem is the expansion and contraction of the pegbox itself but, don't worry, I'm not about to jump onto modern geared pegs without a lot of thought. I don't play much these days so the time spent tuning isn't a serious problem for me.

Do you find any problems using gut for the tailpiece? Sensitivity to humidity in that place could be less easy to correct.

Glenn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...