Thomas Coleman

Violin geometry references

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4 minutes ago, Ben Hebbert said:

If you stuck to geometry you wouldn't end up so preoccupied dreaming about your next violin shape - might give you a chance :) 

... three swipes of a compass, a couple of straight lines and you can finish up to exercise your mojo in preparation for a night of lurve... 

for the dance floor music I suggest  "el rey del compas"

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56 minutes ago, David Burgess said:

I imagine you as being way beyond hot, and well beyond my capacity to deliver. :)

Aren't the French guys supposed to be better at flirting? Francois, can you step up to the plate?

I hate to disappoint you, but the temptation that I'm resisting is to make cheap, fast, and nasty sarcastic use of Ben's "heretics" comment in your direction. :P

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10 minutes ago, Ben Hebbert said:

If you stuck to geometry you wouldn't end up so preoccupied dreaming about your next violin shape - might give you a chance :) 

 

So there might still be a chance? :o

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1 minute ago, Violadamore said:

I hate to disappoint you, but the temptation that I'm resisting is to make cheap, fast, and nasty sarcastic use of Ben's "heretics" comment in your direction. :P

I am way beyond crushed! :(

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1 hour ago, Ben Hebbert said:

Why not?

To me there is a very simple answer - you are describing a kind of complex universal microcosm which draws from every single part of nature. On doing so, you are calling for ideas that are parallel to Mersenne, Anathasia Kircher, Robert Fludd, Dee, the Rosicrucians and the concept of Musica Universalis... 

I'd love to go down that route - truly,  and your post amplifies what I have said about the fact that some (student) has used your formula to create an unusual violin shape is no guarantee of quality. However or the moment I think that Geometry and/or proportion are two huge subjects until there are enough people on Maestronet who have acquainted themselves with the major texts of a sixteenth century university education. :) 

.... a picture says a thousand words, so here's why not :) IMG_4072.JPG.457b79a8937df2245beae4f22db85757.JPG

 

So it would take a thread the size of the giant dumpster that Bass Clef inflicted on The Auction Scroll, but since it would be being filled with gloriously beautiful material, I don't see a problem with that.  :)

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12 minutes ago, Violadamore said:

So it would take a thread the size of the giant dumpster that Bass Clef inflicted on The Auction Scroll, but since it would be being filled with gloriously beautiful material, I don't see a problem with that.  :)

You are of course including David Burgess in what you call "gloriously beautiful material? 

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Just now, Ben Hebbert said:

You are of course including David Burgess in what you call "gloriously beautiful material? 

BWWWWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!  Ummm, not really. :huh:

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2 minutes ago, Ben Hebbert said:

You are of course including David Burgess in what you call "gloriously beautiful material? 

More likely, she was relegating me to that aforementioned giant dumpster.

But we all know that "hard to get" game, right? :)

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7 minutes ago, Violadamore said:

BWWWWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!  Ummm, not really. :huh:

Violadamore, your such a flirt [methinks she's playing hard to get, David]

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8 minutes ago, Ben Hebbert said:

... ah we both  spotted it simultaneously :) 

A very rare faux pas on her part.

But what I really sense, from my "artistic" end of the spectrum (with all the undefinable enlightenment which this implies) , is that she's more interested in you, and is merely using me as a tool, or a stepping stone.

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4 minutes ago, Ben Hebbert said:

nah, going by her prior reputation, she has a thing for saving things from dumpsters... I think you're in with the better chance than me. 

Good one ! 

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7 minutes ago, Ben Hebbert said:

nah, going by her prior reputation, she has a thing for saving things from dumpsters... I think you're in with the better chance than me. 

Oh wow, good one! :lol:

Oops, Carl beat me to it.

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3 hours ago, francoisdenis said:

No need for admiration, if you understand it, it is enough for me

I believe I do.  Most of the work I have produced, however, is limited to description, making accurate drawings of Cremonese artifacts.  Alas, as Ben's picture-worth-a-thousand-words tells us, three fifths of the human race is condemned to the salt mines. :huh:

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32 minutes ago, Addie said:

 Alas, as Ben's picture-worth-a-thousand-words tells us, three fifths of the human race is condemned to the salt mines. :huh:

LOL, we have a salt mine a few miles south of here, in a town officially named "Saline". Wonder who came up with that name, and whether they got a prize? :lol:

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2 hours ago, francoisdenis said:

for the dance floor music I suggest  "el rey del compas"

I can't imagine a guy who fits bridges with a sawzall would be comfortable at a milango. But if David is truly the King of the Compass, as you suggest, then he may have the touch needed to get a lady to perform a Lustrada on the dance floor.

 

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38 minutes ago, ctanzio said:

I.............. may have the touch needed to get a lady to perform a Lustrada on the dance floor.

 

Now that got my attention.  [Directs a cabeceo at ctanzio] David who?  ^_^

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ydRwCf9Qyw

For those who tuned in late, welcome to Maestronet, where anything may happen in a wandering thread........... :lol:

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1 hour ago, Violadamore said:

Now that got my attention.  [Directs a cabeceo at ctanzio] David who?  ^_^

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ydRwCf9Qyw

For those who tuned in late, welcome to Maestronet, where anything may happen in a wandering thread........... :lol:

Hmm... you and Saunders make a great dance team.  :ph34r:

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1 hour ago, Addie said:

Hmm... you and Saunders make a great dance team.  :ph34r:

Thanks!  [touches up her lipstick]  And I'll bet everybody thought he's the shorter guy in the avatar.  :ph34r:

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On 10/29/2017 at 3:52 PM, Thomas Coleman said:

I know of several resources concerning violin geometry.  I'll list what I know and maybe some of you could fill in the blanks?  Any comments or suggestions about any of the material would also be welcome. 

Francois Denis,  I've studied a bit and have made one drawing using his method.  It is my understanding that his method mostly relates to Strad?  correct?  Worth buying?  I haven't seen it in awhile.

Henry Strobel has a few things in maybe The art of violin making (or one of his books anyway).  Anybody care to give insight into his method?

Ake Ekwall The art of drawing a violin.  I know nothing about it and it's hard to find info.  Is it worth hunting down?

Kevin Coates.  I have briefly perused his book but that's it.  It seems like more of a general, historical overview as opposed to practical.  correct?

Kevin Kelly vids.  really enjoy them and have been dinking around with AutoCad and his videos (actually why I started this thread).  What's your opinion on his methods?

Sergei Muratov book.  I have a pdf of it.  Havn't really looked at it a whole lot.  Are his methods sound?

Anything you care to comment on or add would be helpful and appreciated

An excellent review of historic drawing techniques is the book "Creating Shapes in Civil and Naval Architecture (History of Science and Medicine Library)" edited by Horst Nowacki and Wolfgang Lefevre, 2009

I learned that wooden ships were often built with molds in order to exactly duplicate their shapes which is similar to violin makers using molds.

I can't afford to buy this book (151$) but there are many long passages from the book which are posted on the web for reviews.

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2 hours ago, Marty Kasprzyk said:

An excellent review of historic drawing techniques is the book "Creating Shapes in Civil and Naval Architecture (History of Science and Medicine Library)" edited by Horst Nowacki and Wolfgang Lefevre, 2009

I learned that wooden ships were often built with molds in order to exactly duplicate their shapes which is similar to violin makers using molds.

I can't afford to buy this book (151$) but there are many long passages from the book which are posted on the web for reviews.

Turns out there's more than one way to build a boat as well. Most builders I have worked with use fairing sticks to work out the inevitable discrepancies from scale measurements to full size, they always referred to "eye sweet" or to "put your good eye on it" measurements and theory are all good and all ,but the real test is how she rides and handles. The best boat designers all seem to build upon the past, are not restricted by dogma ,willing to gamble a bit on outcomes, and use whatever means available within their grasp.

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Another reference related to the issue of geometry: 

Shapes-of-the-Baroque_Monical.pdf

My point being that, looking at Baroque instruments might stimulate thinking about how geometric design approaches themselves might have evolved.  If we take one of the approaches under discussion here and assumed it was used (recognizing not everyone buys into this assumption), how would that approach have looked in the Baroque period?  Just simpler (at the very least, fewer steps in the absence of most if not all recurves)?  Or would it have had some different components.  While there may not be a straight evolutionary line between Baroque instruments and the violin family, that doesn't necessarily exclude one between geometric design approaches, does it?

Edited by Julian Cossmann Cooke
Completeness

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