dillywilly

Selling an expensive violin

Recommended Posts

4 minutes ago, LeMaster said:

 

#1 - I'm admitting upfront that I don't sell instruments,  I play them.  Most everyone on MN knows this; it's not a state secret.  In the natural course of a professional career spanning a half - century I have of must needs come into contact with a great many high end violin shops, both in Chicago and New York, beginning at Wurlitzer in the very early 70's while I was stationed at West Point. Your analogy sucks (in addition to being plain wrong, and probably put out there with malicious intent.)

#2 - a couple years back I sent Tarisio my French bow for their "experience and expertise" in setting a range of prices I could expect for it at auction.  They responded " $8 - 11 thousand USD."  I sold it a year later via a high end dealer in Chicago for $18,000, which netted me a check for $16,000.  Consider yourself chided once more.

I believe my analogy is more than pertinent, and I'll just consider the source regarding the proposed chide.

Your personal example is comparing apples to oranges. You do realize this, don't you?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Melvin Goldsmith said:

Come on!.The original post is not genuine....it was just a shill post to call out the rats on MN!

 

I understand and appreciate your point, however it appears its authenticity has become immaterial.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mark Neukirchen said:

I believe my analogy is more than pertinent, and I'll just consider the source regarding the proposed chide.

Your personal example is comparing apples to oranges. You do realize this, don't you?

Sir, it is you who is determined to continue touting Tarisio, not me.
Maybe read your own posts.  Just a thought.

Good day to you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Melvin Goldsmith said:

I doubt the original post is anything more than a shill but given the number of PM's it got it certainly confirms the amount of voracious bottom feeders that frequent this site. In the unlikely event that the OP is genuine and thinking of Boston then they should consult Reuning

 

Melvin, did you read the PMs? How do you know that they contained voracious bottom-feeding activity?:unsure:

If the OP post was a wind-up, why would you chose to mistrust everything about it except the suggestion that the alleged 38 PMs were evidence of unconscionable greed? 

And as I said in an earlier post, what exactly is wrong with members of this forum trying to get a violin on consignment? I wouldn't be in any way surprised if all of the upstanding fellows recommended here have been in touch with the OP. That's the business.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, martin swan said:

Melvin, did you read the PMs? How do you know that they contained voracious bottom-feeding activity?:unsure:

If the OP post was a wind-up, why would you chose to mistrust everything about it except the suggestion that the alleged 38 PMs were evidence of unconscionable greed? 

And as I said in an earlier post, what exactly is wrong with members of this forum trying to get a violin on consignment? I wouldn't be in any way surprised if all of the upstanding fellows recommended here have been in touch with the OP. That's the business.

 

I was not aware that the business is best conducted on dodgy internet forums but 

 

46 minutes ago, martin swan said:

Melvin, did you read the PMs? How do you know that they contained voracious bottom-feeding activity?:unsure:

If the OP post was a wind-up, why would you chose to mistrust everything about it except the suggestion that the alleged 38 PMs were evidence of unconscionable greed? 

And as I said in an earlier post, what exactly is wrong with members of this forum trying to get a violin on consignment? I wouldn't be in any way surprised if all of the upstanding fellows recommended here have been in touch with the OP. That's the business.

 

I'm on good terms with most of the top players in the trade....I think they can do their business fine without worrying about fake posts like this on MN

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, nathan slobodkin said:

Larry, 

My reply to your PM through the site got kicked back. Please send an email to the address on my website or perhaps some kind soul could tell me how to reply via maestronet..

Thanks

Thank you Nathan, I appreciate your kindness.

lemaster6@yahoo.com

Have a great weekend.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Mark Neukirchen said:

I must admit that I find it absolutely amazing to be repeatedly chided for suggesting that Tarisio would be a fine and professional method for liquidating the OP’s violin. It’s almost as if it is felt that their staff lacks the experience and expertise to properly handle the sale, or perhaps there could be alternative motives. I’m surprised that Tarisio hasn’t chimed in yet.

 

8 hours ago, Melvin Goldsmith said:

Come on!.The original post is not genuine....it was just a shill post to call out the rats on MN!

Certainly, the authenticity of the OPs post must have crossed the minds of many here, but I agree past a point that immaterial.    If the post is not authentic and wound up the board, so be it.  Good behavior and judgement should, I feel, be exhibited in any case.  I do have some tracking "tools" on this site, BTW.  I saw no reason to use them in this case.

Mark; To be clear, depending on the piece and the situation, Tarisio might be a very viable outlet or it may not be.  It's not unusual for me to recommend them when I feel it appropriate when I'm consulting.  (One of) my point is/was we don't have enough details to know.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, Jeffrey Holmes said:

Mark; To be clear, depending on the piece and the situation, Tarisio might be a very viable outlet or it may not be.  It's not unusual for me to recommend them when I feel it appropriate when I'm consulting.  (One of) my point is/was we don't have enough details to know.

Please share some potential circumstances that you feel would preclude Tarisio from being a viable outlet for a fine $1,000,000+ violin, as described?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Jeffrey Holmes said:

 

Certainly, the authenticity of the OPs post must have crossed the minds of many here

 

;)

Not only that a statement like "nobody doubted it's authenticity" without regard to any respected expert is very, very weak for a top range instrument, I'm wondering if the discretion of the trade is in fact so well, that there won't be any talk about somebody running across US with such an object. Most probably some members here would be supposed to know about it, won't they?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Mark Neukirchen said:

Please share some potential circumstances that you feel would preclude Tarisio from being a viable outlet for a fine $1,000,000+ violin, as described?

 

OK to be clear, there are no circumstances that would preclude Tarisio from being a viable outlet. However, in my view, a Tarisio auction would in most cases be the wrong way to go with a fine 7 figure instrument - but if that was the case Tarisio themselves would recommend that they take it on as a private sale. There is a world of difference. You can look on their website if you want to see how that works.

If the owner wanted a quick sale and insisted on putting it into auction, that would be the owner's prerogative,.

And though it galls me to say it Carlos, Tarisio would be an excellent choice either for a private sale or an auction sale. <_<

 

Mark, if you don't mind, I am concerned to know what your own perspective is here - for example, have you ever sold an instrument at auction?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is an example of a 7 figure violin which should do well at auction.

http://ingleshayday.com/the-ex-croall-mcewen.html

It has a long line of provenance, it's well documented and is in publications, there's a big recording history, and it's in great condition. It's also being sold off as part of the liquidation of a failed bank. This is a rather narrow set of circumstances - no danger that it won't meet an acceptable sale price (which would kill it for the future), and an unsentimental seller who just wants to dispose of it.

Could be quite an event!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, martin swan said:

It's also being sold off as part of the liquidation of a failed bank.

I wonder if they used a repo man.

Seriously, what a lovely sight to see this morning. Thanks for the link.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Mark Neukirchen said:

Please share some potential circumstances that you feel would preclude Tarisio from being a viable outlet for a fine $1,000,000+ violin, as described?

 

Why?  You have one just like it?  If you do, why don't you make an appointment, drive up, and we can discuss the situation?   :) 

Because I'm sensitive when responding to a twisted interpretation (intentional or not) of what I wrote, I will mention that I used two words: "very viable".  I went on to say "or it may not be".  "Very viable" implies something slightly different than the word "viable" without the qualifier (Viable Def: having a reasonable chance of succeeding). If you prefer, you may substitute the most viable, or the most advisable, the most appropriate, or the best... or not the...

If you read what I wrote I'd bet you'd be able to come up several potential risks in an auction venue, and others in a retail venue, that I've already pointed to.  I believe I've been even handed, consistent, and offered accurate information (including that small detail of buyer's premiums that you didn't)... at least I've made an effort to. I am aware you've witnessed enough within the business to realize there are marked differences between auction and retail, (before during and after a sale) which remain even if an auction house offers private sales in addition to public ones.  Without enough information from a seller (and there isn't enough from the OP to make any more than an educated "guess"). I will happily retreat back  into my own nice, safe, professional fantasy world and act like one (a professional), thank you very much.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/5/2017 at 5:31 AM, martin swan said:

OK to be clear, there are no circumstances that would preclude Tarisio from being a viable outlet. However, in my view, a Tarisio auction would in most cases be the wrong way to go with a fine 7 figure instrument - but if that was the case Tarisio themselves would recommend that they take it on as a private sale. There is a world of difference. You can look on their website if you want to see how that works.

If the owner wanted a quick sale and insisted on putting it into auction, that would be the owner's prerogative,.

And though it galls me to say it Carlos, Tarisio would be an excellent choice either for a private sale or an auction sale. <_<

 

Mark, if you don't mind, I am concerned to know what your own perspective is here - for example, have you ever sold an instrument at auction?

Sorry for the delayed reply. I’m assuming that you mean ‘curious’ and not ‘concerned’. In any event, I have sold numerous instruments at auction as well as private/consignment sales over the years. Admittedly, the values of my instruments were not anywhere close to the value of the OP’s.  When I have utilized Tarisio, I have always been more than pleased with the results.

My reason for continued participation in this thread is due to the borderline mockery I received for the mere suggestion of Tarisio being a viable option for the sale of the OP’s violin. It’s almost as if I had suggested for DillyWilly to snap some cellphone photos and post it on Craigslist. One individual went so far as to say that such advice originates from “ill-informed amateurs.” Really?

Tarisio has likely sold more rare and valuable instruments over the last 12 months than all the individuals participating in this thread have over their entire lives -- combined.  And while mere quantity may seem somewhat irrelevant, it does display the level of trust that has been bestowed to them by very prominent individuals and organizations. Their past auction sales include the Isaac Stern collection, the magnificent Lady Blunt, the Molitor, the Primrose, the Delay, etc, etc.

https://tarisio.com/auctions/notable-sales/

Their private sales record is no less impressive.

https://tarisio.com/private-sales/

I’m certainly not saying that Tarisio is the only valid option for liquidating the OP’s instrument, but to suggest that it is not a very valid option seems to me to be “ill-informed” and/or possibly duplicitous.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/5/2017 at 10:17 AM, Jeffrey Holmes said:

Why?  You have one just like it?  If you do, why don't you make an appointment, drive up, and we can discuss the situation?   :) 

Because I'm sensitive when responding to a twisted interpretation (intentional or not) of what I wrote, I will mention that I used two words: "very viable".  I went on to say "or it may not be".  "Very viable" implies something slightly different than the word "viable" without the qualifier (Viable Def: having a reasonable chance of succeeding). If you prefer, you may substitute the most viable, or the most advisable, the most appropriate, or the best... or not the...

If you read what I wrote I'd bet you'd be able to come up several potential risks in an auction venue, and others in a retail venue, that I've already pointed to.  I believe I've been even handed, consistent, and offered accurate information (including that small detail of buyer's premiums that you didn't)... at least I've made an effort to. I am aware you've witnessed enough within the business to realize there are marked differences between auction and retail, (before during and after a sale) which remain even if an auction house offers private sales in addition to public ones.  Without enough information from a seller (and there isn't enough from the OP to make any more than an educated "guess"). I will happily retreat back  into my own nice, safe, professional fantasy world and act like one (a professional), thank you very much.

I would appreciate if you could expound on how you feel my interpretation twisted what you wrote, as that certainly was not my goal or intention.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/4/2017 at 5:21 PM, LeMaster said:

 

 I was stationed at West Point.

Oh, dear, a ring-knocker.  There goes the neighborhood...............:lol:;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Violadamore said:

Oh, dear, a ring-knocker.  There goes the neighborhood...............:lol:;)

It's been a long time since I heard that phrase.  Cool.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Mark Neukirchen said:

I would appreciate if you could expound on how you feel my interpretation twisted what you wrote, as that certainly was not my goal or intention.

Glad it was not your intention. I will expound.

I wrote: "Because I'm sensitive when responding to a twisted interpretation (intentional or not) of what I wrote, I will mention that I used two words: "very viable".  I went on to say "or it may not be". "Very viable" implies something slightly different than the word "viable" without the qualifier (Viable Def: having a reasonable chance of succeeding). If you prefer, you may substitute the most viable, or the most advisable, the most appropriate, or the best... or not the..."

You asked me "Please share some potential circumstances that you feel would preclude Tarisio from being a viable outlet..."

I never said Tarisio would not be "a viable outlet". I did say there are circumstances one venue or another (Tarisio in this case) might or might not be a "very viable" outlet... true for pretty much any venue depending on circumstance.... and suggested that with the information at hand, fictitious or not, there just wasn't enough there to make a recommendation. I have not denigrated Tarisio.  I am aware of their potential strengths, and their potential weaknesses, pertaining to specific situations (as I am aware of those of many of my colleagues, and I'm sure many are aware of mine). I mentioned that I recommend them when I believe they would be a "very viable" venue or a specific piece and/or a specific situation.

I've been consistent throughout this thread in that assertion.  I've not recommended ANYONE as an agent. The only thing I did was to invite the OP to contact me IF he wanted a recommendation of someone knowledgeable and experienced to speak with in a town he already planned to visit. I would personally have several questions concerning the OPs description, BTW.  A Wurlitzer cert from 1900? "No question" about authenticity? 25% consignment commission? Actual condition/advisable restorations? Don't know if this gentleman is "for real" or not.. but that would not alter how I would respond as a professional.

I am not, and did not, mock you for suggesting, then endorsing, Tarisio. I did point out that the information you provided (which essentially I'd already provided) was incomplete and that I felt not knowing pertinent details made an endorsement of a particular venue (ANY VENUE) premature and possibly reckless. Sorry if you took exception to that opinion, but it's an honest one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 05/02/2017 at 7:16 AM, martin swan said:

Here is an example of a 7 figure violin which should do well at auction.

http://ingleshayday.com/the-ex-croall-mcewen.html

It has a long line of provenance, it's well documented and is in publications, there's a big recording history, and it's in great condition. It's also being sold off as part of the liquidation of a failed bank. This is a rather narrow set of circumstances - no danger that it won't meet an acceptable sale price (which would kill it for the future), and an unsentimental seller who just wants to dispose of it.

Could be quite an event!

We need a thread for it ! wow !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/5/2017 at 7:16 AM, martin swan said:

Here is an example of a 7 figure violin which should do well at auction.

http://ingleshayday.com/the-ex-croall-mcewen.html

It has a long line of provenance, it's well documented and is in publications, there's a big recording history, and it's in great condition. It's also being sold off as part of the liquidation of a failed bank. This is a rather narrow set of circumstances - no danger that it won't meet an acceptable sale price (which would kill it for the future), and an unsentimental seller who just wants to dispose of it.

Could be quite an event!

If only contemporary makers had such a level of provenance, like Queens using the scroll to pleasure themselves. ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.