German violin? ID from ebay


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That's what I did with my violin bow. :rolleyes:
I was on vacation in Italy and I checked a lot of violin bows after I could not find anything matches to my budget is israel.

I bought a fantastic bow from a man named walter Barbiero
The violin bow cost me 2500 euros
When I came to Israel everyone told me that this kind of bow is sold in Israel for at least 3500 Euros ;) 

http://www.walterbarbiero.com/joomla/it/archi/moderno/violino

* I bought a silver mounted, not gold..

 

 

I did not really understand - You already bought good bow and want to buy a violin from ebay seller Mario Güths, which is know to be one of guys selling fake italian violins (junk from Schoenbach)???? :D

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I did not really understand - You already bought good bow and want to buy a violin from ebay seller Mario Güths, which is know to be one of guys selling fake italian violins (junk from Schoenbach)???? :D

I have a great violin. :P
 The problem:

I also teaches violin in elementary schools in groups.

I dont want to teach with my Expensive violin - so I should have also a cheap violin.

I am talking about a lot of little kids that are naturally very curious..

I do not want anything to happen to my precious violin and bow :unsure:

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David. I'll trade you a german violin aprox from 1900 +/- 20years for a air plane ticket and a private tour in Israel. I'll bring it to you.

All set up and ready to play :)

Sounds like a tempting offer :rolleyes: 

Define "tour in Israel" please ;) 

Old churches in Jerusalem and exclusive restaurants will not be part of the menu with me :lol: 

the tour may include private parties until the morning in Tel Aviv

you can get to know the hottest clubs in town :P  :D 

 

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Yeah... Let me see if I can express my feelings about clubbing. I would rather burn the violin in question than to be forced to go "partying until the morning" and "get to know the hottest clubs in Tel Aviv."
No need for fancy restaurants. There is a great shawarma-place on Jaffa street, and with plenty of hummus that will do. Excluding Jerusalem would be a dealbreaker. ;)
 

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Yeah... Let me see if I can express my feelings about clubbing. I would rather burn the violin in question than to be forced to go "partying until the morning" and "get to know the hottest clubs in Tel Aviv."

No need for fancy restaurants. There is a great shawarma-place on Jaffa street, and with plenty of hummus that will do. Excluding Jerusalem would be a dealbreaker. ;)

 

Sounds good! I'm ready to show you where the best hummus in Israel,

good shawarma can be found in almost every big city in Israel.

And bonus you did not specify - excellent falafel!

now Let me bring you real dealbreaker - we have an amazing philharmonic orchestra in israel, my violin teacher Plays the viola in the orchestra so I always have free tickets to all of their concerts  ^_^

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I think you all going to have to review your Dutzenarbeit, as this is not one of them, and clearly a French Mirecourt.fiddle in every way. 

 

Cheap and nasty, yes, Dutzenarbeit, no...

 

Are you talking about the ebay-violin or the dissasembeld one a couple of posts up?

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I think this is all a bit ironic. The violin is as Peter says - what we describe as "Caussin School", Mirecourt late 19th century. It's in unusually good condition and is rather better work than most, proper purfling, scroll not completely laughable. I think it may actually be Caussin workshop.

For budget violins these tend to sound very good, and in plauing condition the retail price would be well over £2000.

I don't know this seller but I can't find fault with the description - it mentions that the fingerboard is loose and it explicitly states that the label is not to be trusted.

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For budget violins these tend to sound very good, and in plauing condition the retail price would be well over £2000.

 

 

If the seller's place wasn't half a day away I would take a look - in my experience those violins are a bit like Forrest's box of chocolate, you never know..

 

Too often they need a regraduation (similar to the Dutzend), cause the workers stopped work before really finished due to lack of time. Especially a crackfree condition can be an evidence that the woods are thick as a brick ^_^ .

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 Quote Mr. Blankface: Especially a crackfree condition can be an evidence that the woods are thick as a brick  ^_^ .


 


What does Jethro Tull have to do with this?  :lol:  :ph34r: 


How thick is too thick? 4mm?


 


Martin and Blankface, what are the Caussin school characteristics in the eBay violin? 


 


David:What about Yael Rosenblum?  I heard very good things about her, or is she out of your price range?

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Martin and Blankface, what are the Caussin school characteristics in the eBay violin?

I would like a coherent answer to this question too.

I have long since been aware that there are cheap school violins from France as well as from Saxon/N. Bohemia, although I get no exposure to these, since in Austria the „French“ ones are almost non-existent. I do however get a shock when I visit France. The only way I get to notice much difference is if I have to take one to bits, and see the different (shoddy) inside work. I certainly don't see any reason why a cheap and nasty French school violin should worth more or less than a similar Saxon/Bohemian one and there would defiantly be no price difference in my shop.

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If the seller's place wasn't half a day away I would take a look - in my experience those violins are a bit like Forrest's box of chocolate, you never know..

 

Too often they need a regraduation (similar to the Dutzend), cause the workers stopped work before really finished due to lack of time. Especially a crackfree condition can be an evidence that the woods are thick as a brick ^_^ .

 

Yes there is a very wide range of qualities, from "Caussin School" monstrosities which have inked purfling, 'monkey with a mallet' scrolls, and quite alarmingly aysmmetrical f-holes, all the way through to Nicolas &/or Hippolyte Caussins. This one has a reasonable scroll (for the genre), nice purfling and quite consistent edgework, a good button, relatively accurate f-holes and coherent arching. As such I would be surprised if it was thick as a brick.

I'll try to do a list of features at some point later in the day.

As far as pricing is concerned, there's often a lack of logic in the violin trade. With Mirecourt violins it may just be a historical preference amongst UK dealers. I do often find myself baffled buy the price of a C20 Collin-Mézin compared to a nice EH Roth for example.

But I stand by my statement about sound - I used to handle a lot of these violins, and found them much more consistent than Sch... equivalents when it came to sound. Perhaps it's down to a certain industrial consistency of wood choice, the use of an outside mould, even the fact that they were made in an environment (a massive workshop/factory) where people were also making good violins rather than on a kitchen bench in a farmer's cottage. I would say ideas about arching are more uniform than in Dutzendarbeit.

I also think the later C20 Mirecourt violins with pressed plates shouldn't be sneered at, and that this was quite an effective way of making a good functional student violin.

 

Coffee time ....

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 Quote Mr. Blankface: Especially a crackfree condition can be an evidence that the woods are thick as a brick  ^_^ .

 

What does Jethro Tull have to do with this?  :lol:  :ph34r:

How thick is too thick? 4mm?

 

Martin and Blankface, what are the Caussin school characteristics in the eBay violin? 

 

Yes there is a very wide range of qualities, from "Caussin School" monstrosities which have inked purfling, 'monkey with a mallet' scrolls, and quite alarmingly aysmmetrical f-holes, all the way through to Nicolas &/or Hippolyte Caussins. This one has a reasonable scroll (for the genre), nice purfling and quite consistent edgework, a good button, relatively accurate f-holes and coherent arching. As such I would be surprised if it was thick as a brick.

I'll try to do a list of features at some point later in the day.

As far as pricing is concerned, there's often a lack of logic in the violin trade.

 

 

 

Indeed the JT quote was intended as a regard to scottish cultural good for a better understanding ;)  - and I would explicit disagree with the assumption, that features like accurate outside workmanship, scroll, purfling etc. are indicating a likewise inner work for this class of manufactured violins. This applies to french as well as for Mnk/Schb.

 

There is no general rule for top thickness (this would go far out of topic here, and I won't dare to give a qualified opinion reg these matters), but the last from outside very neatly made "Caussin school" I've got, much nicer than the OP, had a brick thickness in the central arching (which simply wasn't worked out), making it sound like an iron pan. Not the first, aren't you familiar with these phenomena?

 

Generally spoken, the subtile differences between Dutzend and Caussin school beside constructional issues might be the special appearance of the varnish, the purfling (more regular, broader and of a deeper black), and without taking a second or third look it can be hard to distiguish sometimes. But who would hesitate to exploite the illogicalities of the market to pay the bills? :ph34r:B)

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