An interesting estate sale item?

[Televet]

https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/43188454_early-23-violin-no-makers-name-evident

 

 

I came across this when I was looking at lot 88a, a bow by Jas Tubbs (which has mysteriously been removed from the sale). I know its a bit of a stretch, but since bow and fiddle were likely a team, it may be that this might be quite a pleasant sounding fiddle with a bit of love?

[jacobsaunders]

“FAMILY HISTORY DETAILS IT AS BEING 17TH/18TH CENTURY, AND LATER PLAYED BY GEORGE SIMPSON OF YORKSHIRE, ENGLAND IN THE 1870'S; 23" LONG”

sounds like Auctionierese for a cheap late 19th C Schönbach box

[Televet]

auctioneer flim-flammary apart, the presence of the Tubbs bow, now departed, made me wonder what the violin would sound like. Just thought why would someone ho went to the trouble of buying a decent bow bother to use it with a violin that sounded awful?

 

I still wonder what it will sound like once its cleaned up and set up.

 

Thanks for your succinct comment Mr Saunders!

[La Folia]

Who knows?  Maybe the Tubbs bow just got thrown in at random.  It does look kind of nice considering that the maker cut so many corners (no purfling, probably no corner blocks, +?).  Looks nice inside, could be pretty bad inside.  I believe Jacob Sanders.

 

It hasn't been played for a long time.  If you do play it, replace the tailpiece before you even turn a peg, or it could damage (and maybe even split) the top.

[Will L]

Of course, Televet, I don't think we know that the Tubbs bow is really a Tubbs.  And even if it was, it doesn't mean that Simpson didn't also have a better violin, and this bow went with it, instead of this violin.  In short, only sometimes do bows go with violins; usually when some famous violinist was known to have used them together.  So the idea that a violin might be pretty good because someone went to the expense of buying a good bow is stretching the imagination beyond what is safe for bidders at an auction.  

 

We could carry ourselves away with imagination:  George Simpson may have studied with Ysaye, who certainly would have not recommended anything but a superb instrument for a budding genius.  Simpson MUST have died young, otherwise we'd have evidence of his brilliance in recordings and lists of famous violinists.  So, even though the violin is a cheap commercial instrument, surely Simpson would have demanded a fine playing instrument.  This MUST BE a fine playing instrument.  And that Tubbs bow!  That's the clincher!  Let me grab the check book before someone beats me to this remarkable chance!.     Well, you get the idea.  I'm only exaggerating to make a point. 

[Televet]

Will L. It wasn't that I thought that this violin was anything particularly special, rather just the idle speculation that it might sound decent given that the bow that was in the box with it was a Tubbs:- see OP, where the words ' I know its a stretch, but...' appear.

 

More than ninety per cent of the fun of buying stuff at auction is in the imagination:- at least for me, and especially where the item for sale is not immediately usable, which goes for a lot of the violins one finds at even 'respectable' musical instrument auctions, let alone estate auctions!  George Simpson was a Luthier in Yorkshire who produced what is described as 'rough untutored work', and was probably long dead by the time this Violin was built and even if he had played it,it would not necessarily be a recommendation!

 

That bow though...The bow was withdrawn from the auction because there was some discussion about its authenticity (which went along the lines of 'what's a nice bow like you doing with a violin like this) but will likely re surface once the cognoscenti have examined it and given their opinions...and someone paid $400 for the violin ​.