The history of the floral inlayed tailpiece?

[Steenhive]

These tailpieces crop up from time to time on violins at the local auction houses here in Scotland, frequently on unusual and unlabelled violins where I can't tell where they were made.  I'm curious, does anybody here know the history of these tailpieces? Where were they made?  Was there a time when they were in vogue? 

[deans]

I've seen tons of these, usually on cheaper German instruments like the ones sold through the mail order houses (Sears etc). I used to hunt for fiddles a lot back in PA and MD, seemed that every other flea market fiddle had one.

 

My guess is that the ones with flowers, like the one on the right,  originated from the Schonbach region in the late 19th century and reached a peak of popularity in the early 20th century.

[Michael_Molnar]

I always thought these were just modern fantasies hoping to find a market. 

[Rue]

I quite like them.

[deans]

There was a recent thread with pics of the 1902 Sears catalogue, it had several ranging from 8-22 cents each... 

[Guest]

I quite like them.

So do I. I have several of them. Just don't clean them with alcohol or acetone because it will wipe away all the colored lines which are just ink.

[Addie]

I think they're hideous.    (I associate them with cheap old Mark/Schön violins)

 

I do like the shield inlays. 

 

Steenhive, what is the animal in your avatar?  My Pictish pictorial recognition skills aren't the best.  I usually get the cup-and-ring right though. 

[Dwight Brown]

The one I used to covet were the ones with the big gold blobs on them.  It always meant Moennigs to us :-)

 

 

DLB

[Rue]

I think they're hideous...

Ouchie! Harsh!

[deans]

Never liked the big gold blobs, but they never seemed to be attached to a bad fiddle.....

[Steenhive]

 

Steenhive, what is the animal in your avatar?  My Pictish pictorial recognition skills aren't the best.  I usually get the cup-and-ring right though. 

It's a Pictish Beast Addie, which might be a dolphin or a mythical water kelpie, nobody knows for sure.  Just recently there were stones found a couple miles from me.  Looking forward to seeing them if a museum gets them.

[Ron1]

Do dolphins and water kelpies have tails like that?  And legs?  But, this is getting exciting, I just heard that someone found some stones near my neighborhood too!

[Violadamore]

It's a Pictish Beast Addie,..........

As opposed to a "Canadian Beast Addie"?  (You may have just inadvertently christened your avatar).  [begins working on a phylogenetic chart for a proposed new genus, Addietheria, combining some of the more questionable aspects of platypuses, wolverines, and historians....] 

[Rue]

Pretty sure it's not a Canuck...

[Addie]

It's a Pictish Beast Addie, which might be a dolphin or a mythical water kelpie, nobody knows for sure.  Just recently there were stones found a couple miles from me.  Looking forward to seeing them if a museum gets them.

I think I know...

 

 

It's a symbol stone for Clan an Penguin.

 

And here's a pic for folklore geeks...

 

[Addie]

As opposed to a "Canadian Beast Addie"?  (You may have just inadvertently christened your avatar).  [begins working on a phylogenetic chart for a proposed new genus, Addietheria, combining some of the more questionable aspects of platypuses, wolverines, and historians....] 

My avatar is a cartoon from Punch, circa 1950's

[Ben Hebbert]

It's interesting that you have a shield inlay as well.. Those definitely evolved from bow making, but so did the flowers. You get a lot of 1820s ish Bausch and Knopf and other neukirchen bows with either the flowers or the shield. When you see the proper work, it's outstandingly good! The Knopf that randomly ended up in the Hill Collection at the Ashmolean (and I think is in the Retford book) is an example of an outstandingly high quality bow through and through with a floral inlay. Sadly the later nineteenth century saw the reputation plummet with zillions of particularly rubbish parodies being produced.

[Bruce Carlson]

Never liked the big gold blobs, but they never seemed to be attached to a bad fiddle.....

Usually on violins sold through Moennigs of Philadelphia. That is, if it is a gold oval. Very kitsch.

[BassClef]

I Like the mass produced floral ones. The white flowers are my favorite of the bunch.

[Ben Hebbert]

Well, everything's better than those Henryk Kaston produced castings of the Guarneri coat of arms that end up on far too many del Gesu tailpieces. ... 

 

I've never disagreed with Bruce so vehemently before, but I have a soft spot for Moennig gold ovals. I think they are quite classy!

[Rue]

Now that's something I find endlessly interesting...personal opinion.

 

Why is a gold oval considered kitsch or class? Why is a simple floral considered kitsch or not?

[Rue]

...sorry...double post.

[deans]

I dont particularly care that much for the looks of the M&sons gold blob. But I learned violin back in PA where good players bought their good violins from that shop (I wasnt one of them). One of my teachers had a spectacular Testore. Back in the day that shop was considered to be the rock-solid place to buy a good fiddle and there is enough nostalgia there for me that getting an instrument with the gold blob is on my bucket list.

 

Unfortunately I am finding auctions/dealers are increasingly poo-poo-ing attributions of fiddles with the gold blob, maybe for good reason, maybe not-just the nature of the business.

[gizmomonster]

I think they are pretty. This one has a nice tailpiece that doesn't look like the other ones I've seen.  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Old-Antique-Vintage-4-4-Czech-Violin-/181794030439?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a53c4c367

 

I found another 'fiddle' I was thinking of buying that has an inlaid tailpiece and an inlaid fingerboard. It was very pretty but looked like it had been put on a much older violin that was being used as a fiddle. The violin looked old and had a grafted scroll. 

[deans]

Gizmo, wow, thats about as fancy as I've seen for this type of tailpiece, cant put much more pearl on one. The fiddle looks like standard issue mail order though.