Saving a bow tip

[RyanJ]

Is there a way of salvaging a bow tip that has a crack on the top of the mortise? The tip on the bow is quite nice, and I would rather not replace it. I heard some people put a drop of super glue to close it.

Kind regards.

[uncle duke]

Are you talking about the bone or plastic that has a crack on the side or split down the middle?   Two years ago I had 1 small crack along the skinny side where the mortise is.  Now there's one on the other side but nothing is delaminanting? yet.  A small pinhead drop of super glue shouldn't hurt.

[Omobono]

Using this graphic from Guy Gallo's reference thread, where exactly is the crack?

One of the two arrowed spots, yellow or red, or somewhere else?

 

[uncle duke]

Mine are at exactly where the little white speck is at the point of the face arrow.  One on each side.  It's bone, I think, over a black laminate.  Didn't mean to hog the space JRyn.

[Omobono]

So it is the 'ivory' (or substitute) plate that is cracked near the tip mortise?

If so I would think that is a fairly common breakage.

No great harm, unless you are talking about something else?

[Brad Dorsey]

Is there a way of salvaging a bow tip that has a crack on the top of the mortise? ... I heard some people put a drop of super glue to close it...

 

If by "salvaging a bow tip" you mean taking the tip off to re-use it, the answer is no.  But I don't think you mean that.

 

You can dab a drop of superglue on the tip where it is broken.  If the tip is loose, this would re-glue it to the head of the bow.  But it will not firmly glue the two sides of the crack together so that the strength of the tip across the crack is restored to what it was before it cracked.

 

The place where you indicated that your tip is cracked -- at the outer corners of the mortise -- is the most delicate part of a bow head, because there is so little material there.  It is fairly common to see tip cracks here.  If someone were to try to cram too much hair into the head mortise or use a plug that is too big, the tip can easily crack there.    And even worse, the wood of the bow head can crack, too.  The tip performs an important function by strengthening the head of the bow at these two delicate spots.  If the tip is cracked in those spots, the head has lost the re-inforcement that the tip provides there.  I have heard that some bow people refuse to rehair a bow with tip cracks in these spots without first replacing the tip.

[RyanJ]

Yes, it is where the yellow arrow is pointed. The plate is original and i'm hoping the glue will give it another year or two.

[Omobono]

If by "salvaging a bow tip" you mean taking the tip off to re-use it, the answer is no.  But I don't think you mean that.

Just to clarify?

How do you define "tip"?

What is carved from one of these blanks?

(Those graphics above may not be so helpful)

[Brad Dorsey]

...How do you define "tip"?...

 

 When I say "tip," I mean the decorative and protective covering of the face of the head of a bow.  The face is the surface with the hair mortise.  The tip is also called the face plate.  Your picture shows a tip blank.

 

...What is carved from one of these blanks?...

 

A finished tip is carved from one of these blanks after it is glued to the head of a bow.  Usually a tip liner is glued between the tip and the face of the head.  The liner is usually ebony.

[uncle duke]

A face plate like Omobona shows it may be a stiff material.  Do those form without heat?

[Omobono]

 When I say "tip," I mean the decorative and protective covering of the face of the head of a bow.  The face is the surface with the hair mortise.  The tip is also called the face plate.  Your picture shows a tip blank.

 

A finished tip is carved from one of these blanks after it is glued to the head of a bow.  Usually a tip liner is glued between the tip and the face of the head.  The liner is usually ebony.

Thanks, Brad.

Didn't mean to make it complicated.

Just thought it worth tidying up because in player's parlance the 'tip of the bow' can be less specific.

[Omobono]

A face plate like Omobono shows it may be a stiff material.  Do those form without heat?

Obviously it could be made from a number of materials, ivory or substitute, a synthetic material, or metal, but all stiff.

I'm not sure what you mean about 'heating'? Is the   material heated in fixing it to the wood of the bow?

[uncle duke]

Obviously it could be made from a number of materials, ivory or substitute, a synthetic material, or metal, but all stiff.

I'm not sure what you mean about 'heating'? Is the   material heated in fixing it to the wood of the bow?

Yes, pre-form the face plate with heat.  I can't see how a replacement piece can fit without breaking, though I haven't tried.  Plastic looks cheap.  If I were to attempt replacing the plate myself is there a way to remove old tip without disturbing the ebony laminate piece?    

[Omobono]

If I were to attempt replacing the plate myself is there a way to remove old tip without disturbing the ebony laminate piece?    

I'll steer away from that one (and maybe you should too.....)

[RyanJ]

I'll steer away from that one (and maybe you should too.....)

Maybe an explanation would help us stop dwelling on the thought. Is it simply easier to replace the two together?

[uncle duke]

I'll steer away from that one (and maybe you should too.....)

I could slowly and carefully scrape old one away.  Remove plug and knot/hair.  Clean gluing surface.  Now, my replacement tip piece is flat.  The head of the bow is curved/sloped- does the new piece conform or not?

[FiddleDoug]

If the face plate is cracked where the white arrow points in Omobono's post #5, I have been taught (by a real master) not to rehair it until the face plate has been replaced (Yes, I would refuse to rehair a client's bow like that.). I don't know of any way to remove a face plate without damaging it, and if it's not damaged, why remove it. (an exception would be rplacing an ivory tip for a traveling musician). Bone replacement tips are really hard to work, and don't bend well with heat. I wouldn't use ivory (even Mammoth ivory) these days. One of the latest tip replacements is called Tip Armor, and seems to get good reviews.

[RyanJ]

Any consensus on mother of pearl tips?

[Brad Dorsey]

...is there a way to remove old tip without disturbing the ebony laminate piece?    

 

Yes.  File off the old tip carefully.  Stop filing when it's all gone.  I do this whenever I replace a tip and the tip liner is in good shape.

 

Be aware that the tip liner is usually in two pieces -- one on the face of the head and a much smaller one one the very end of the head.  Sometimes the face piece remains intact while the end piece is lost.  If that happens, I glue a replacement oversize end piece to the tip before gluing the tip to the head of the bow.

 

 

...Is it simply easier to replace the two together?

 

I don't think so.  For me, replacing a tip on top of an old tip liner is easier than replacing both the tip and the liner.

[Brad Dorsey]

Any consensus on mother of pearl tips?

 

I have never seen one, and I don't know if I've ever heard of one.

[Omobono]

I hadn't either till:

 

 

http://www.jbabows.com/galleryV/index.html

[Conor Russell]

I've seen a tip made completely of pearl. It looked dreadful. 

 

If the lining is all there and solid, I try to keep it. Apart from anything else, it gives a good indication of the shape of the original tip, and how to cut the new one.