fiddlesurgeon Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 This came in an email advertisement yesterday. Has anyone seen or tried these yet. Is this different from the sound composites that was previously discussed here? http://acavalloviolins.com/details.php?prodID=1119&CAT=5 Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjohnbarleycorn Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 hmmm no picture? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGV Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 $40 is a bit steep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiddlesurgeon Posted March 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 There wasn't one to the information link. There is actually a little more to the email. They are not yet available, not until April 30, 2015. Here is the picture with the ad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiddlesurgeon Posted March 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 $40 is a bit steep. Yeah, that is pushing it. Maybe the sustainable aspect and improved longevity are worth the difference. btw, the email ad says advance orders will get 25% off. Is that 25% off of the already discounted $40.00 price tag? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGV Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 Since this is new technology (i.e. unproven in my book), I don't think I would pay more than $20 to experiment with one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Stross Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 Since this is new technology (i.e. unproven in my book), I don't think I would pay more than $20 to experiment with one. I have a couple of older chinese violins with all fittings made out of some sort of "bakelite". The fingerboards look great , do not wear and stayed glued for over 40 years by now. They don't feel the same but as I do not play, I can't really comment on that. I believe that plastic replacements good as they may be, will cost substantially more to make than ebony ones which at the moment, wholesale under $2 for large qtys and under $3 for medium ones. There is no shortage of ebony for short ( violin ) fingerboards but larger sizes might benefit from a good alternative material. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Brown Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 Maybe some sort of laminate would work? It could be hollow in the middle and have a layer of ebony on the outside. It would probably be stronger and more stable than solid wood. That said, is the ebony supply getting that bad? I should build a big greenhouse and grow trees my great grandson could sell. People in Colorado seem to be able to grow very profitable crops in their basements.......:-) DLB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Stross Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 That said, is the ebony supply getting that bad? Musical instruments are not making a dent in the ebony supply. Using it for fire wood ( it's most common use in Africa ) and using it for flooring in Asia are a problem. In the same time it's the only income for a lot of very poor people and we can't blame them for trying to make a living. What's starting to become scarce is African Blackwood and that affects clarinets I believe. Though a replacement is long available there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duane88 Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 $40 is a bit steep. I haven't purchased a decent ebony board for less than 50 bucks in years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGV Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I wish there would be special offers to luthiers for a sample in exchange for feedback/endorsement. If it is as good as it is claimed to be, I don't mind forking $20 for one (shipping included ) and put them on my next violin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGV Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I haven't purchased a decent ebony board for less than 50 bucks in years. Looks like you work in a different league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher Jacoby Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I've used them. They are pretty amazing. No, I'm not making commission from sales of them. They're lighter and stiffer than ebony, They're finished scoop and well balanced, finished underside, glue up beautifully, and you can plane them with any old thing if you want a bit more scoop. Pretty stoked. 40 bucks for a board I don't have to dress? Not that much money at all... Order one and check it out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Burgess Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 That said, is the ebony supply getting that bad? The problem is that for ebony to be completely legal, you must be able to document a chain of custody all the way back to the original cutting, including permits for harvesting from the country of origin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Brown Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 Musical instruments are not making a dent in the ebony supply. Using it for fire wood ( it's most common use in Africa ) and using it for flooring in Asia are a problem. In the same time it's the only income for a lot of very poor people and we can't blame them for trying to make a living. What's starting to become scarce is African Blackwood and that affects clarinets I believe. Though a replacement is long available there. I know that Buffet (the clarinet maker) makes professional model instruments using blacked powder and epoxy or some such glue. They used to be considered one of the best brands and these Green Line instruments make use of every bit of the resource. I think they are also less prone to cracks, etc. I saw a video some time ago that showed an instrument maker turning clarinet bells on a lathe and flaws in the wood caused them to explode rather energetically . http://www.blackwoodconservation.org/greenline.html I think that improved lives for African people is probably in all of mankind's best interest. Solar energy, LED lights, cooking devices that use other fuel all help. I know that just the incidence of lung decease in women cooking over fires inside the dwellings is a concern. http://www.rff.org/Publications/WPC/Pages/09_15_08%20Indoor%20Air%20Pollution%20and%20Africa%20Death%20Rates.aspx DLB Many people in Africa live lives that are in the Paleolithic one moment and the information age the next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Holmes Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 $40 is a bit steep. I pay more than that for really good ebony blanks. If the product claims are realistic, I'd like to get my hands on one and give it a try. Even if the claims are a bit inflated, I think the use of traditional ebony boards on many of the lower end fiddles out there are a bit of a waste of resources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Stross Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I think that improved lives for African people is probably in all of mankind's best interest. Solar energy, LED lights, cooking devices that use other fuel all help. You are absolutely right. But all these also caused a need for "money". Dependency and so on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeyerFittings Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 It would be nice to know what general realm of material composition we are talking about. Reconstituted catfish whiskers? Discarded doggie bags dyed with coal tar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Stross Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I've used them. They are pretty amazing. No, I'm not making commission from sales of them. You should ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGV Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I've used them. They are pretty amazing. No, I'm not making commission from sales of them. They're lighter and stiffer than ebony, They're finished scoop and well balanced, finished underside, glue up beautifully, and you can plane them with any old thing if you want a bit more scoop. Pretty stoked. 40 bucks for a board I don't have to dress? Not that much money at all... Order one and check it out! Looks like I'm sold! But I have too many ebony violin blanks at the moment. Is there a viola version? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Brown Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 You are absolutely right. But all these also caused a need for "money". Dependency and so on... You are 100% correct. There have been many well meaning tech projects to help in Africa. Water pumps, Farming technology, etc. Many have turned out to be worse than what was before. Most good solutions seem to come from the bottom up. It would be wonderful however to come up with an idea that would really help people have better lives and be able to work on things that were more than just subsistence level activities. The ideal would have been to just leave the folks in Africa alone and let them develop on their own in their own way. Colonization has been going on for almost the whole recorded history of mankind. It would probably be easier to from Ivory and ebony in a lab than solve any real problems in Africa. DLB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher Jacoby Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 It's wood and resin. Not made from dust, not hollow. No viola or cello or bass yet. To be honest, they're less desirable for replacement on an old fiddle than as a finished board you build your neck around on a new violin. They will be, of course, less thick to allow adjustment for extension height on a pre-existing neck set. For me, at least, the pros outweigh the cons, and I did use one on an old violin and make it work. Planes nicely, dulls your blade a bit faster than ebony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Stross Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 You are 100% correct. There have been many well meaning tech projects to help in Africa. Water pumps, Farming technology, etc. Many have turned out to be worse than what was before. Most good solutions seem to come from the bottom up. It would be wonderful however to come up with an idea that would really help people have better lives and be able to work on things that were more than just subsistence level activities. The ideal would have been to just leave the folks in Africa alone and let them develop on their own in their own way. Colonization has been going on for almost the whole recorded history of mankind. It would probably be easier to from Ivory and ebony in a lab than solve any real problems in Africa. DLB You are absolutely right. Every improvement caused a myriad of other problems. Too serious a discussion to have here and now, unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Burgess Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I don't know if this applies to this particular fingerboard, but I was recently contacted by a client who had a fingerboard put on his violin which was made of something like compressed flax fiber and a binder (resin). He wants it changed back to ebony, because he said it harmed the sound. Change the mass and possibly the vibrational characteristics, and you'll probably change the sound. Maybe some fiddles sound better with it though. Or maybe it's a matter of learning to optimize it, which may need to be done differently than with ebony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGV Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 I suppose if one builds a new violin with this kind of fingerboard, the issue of sound will be dealt with during the fine-tuning stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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