Instruments with painted decorations

[Stephen Faulk]

Ok Ben, scanning your post I see we are in line with Richter, I like his work as well. So I have further ideas about your first post, but I have to go work in the shop and will get back later. 

 

And I am happy to see the Beuys piece in the thread. For me his works stand by themselves without the dialogs he created around them, but what he said in conjunction with them is always important. He also has piece with a violin wrapped in a bandage. One would imagine he gave it surgery and doctored it up after Armans brutalisms. 

 

The last one Bruce posted is eggzaclty what I had in mind, however. Violins with painted treatments that are old, but not painted on to identify them as the property of a  royal house.   I want to put together a collection of these images. Now curious about that violin it appears to not have purfling on the back?

 

As usual looks like we are going to talk about three or four things at once, and that is always a hoot. 

[romberg flat]

Hi All,

 

On the subject of decoration. It's not clear to me if this is Pluto (Hades) and Persephone or is it Apollo and Daphne? Perhaps neither. The sides of the violin are also decorated with vegetation or floral arabesque which made me think of Persephone (goddess of vegetation or of the harvest). Decorated with brush and pen using either brown varnish or ink, then covered with a protective coat of varnish. Violin dated 1926 Italian.

 

Bruce

 

decorated violin back.jpg

My guessing – Apollo and Daphne…

 

“Her skin turned into bark, her hair became leaves and her arms transformed into branches. She stopped running as her feet became rooted in ground.”

 

In life she was silent

In death she sing

 

Makes sense…

 

Great work. Who is the artist/maker?

[Ben Hebbert]

Explains a lot nice when things tie in .. Thanks for that.

[The Violin Beautiful]

Maybe I should start a separate thread on this, but I intend to ask my 12 year old artistic granddaughter to decorate my next violin. I assume I will put on the ground. Make it matte with fine sandpaper and then she will use paint. But what kind of paint? Acrylic? Watercolor? some modern concoction?  I don't think oil will work.

 

Advice? Suggestions?

I've seen a few violins decorated with transparent dyes. If you go that route, you can have the artwork without entirely losing the character of the wood. Perhaps you could experiment with a piece of varnished wood and some aniline colors.

[Bruce Carlson]

Ok Ben, scanning your post I see we are in line with Richter, I like his work as well. So I have further ideas about your first post, but I have to go work in the shop and will get back later. 

 

And I am happy to see the Beuys piece in the thread. For me his works stand by themselves without the dialogs he created around them, but what he said in conjunction with them is always important. He also has piece with a violin wrapped in a bandage. One would imagine he gave it surgery and doctored it up after Armans brutalisms. 

 

The last one Bruce posted is eggzaclty what I had in mind, however. Violins with painted treatments that are old, but not painted on to identify them as the property of a  royal house.   I want to put together a collection of these images. Now curious about that violin it appears to not have purfling on the back?

 

As usual looks like we are going to talk about three or four things at once, and that is always a hoot. 

Hi Stephen,

 

No, it's unpurfled. I have some more shots and I KNOW they're in my computer somewhere .................. 

 

Bruce

[Bruce Carlson]

My guessing – Apollo and Daphne…

 

“Her skin turned into bark, her hair became leaves and her arms transformed into branches. She stopped running as her feet became rooted in ground.”

 

In life she was silent

In death she sing

 

Makes sense…

 

Great work. Who is the artist/maker?

His name was del Senno and he was a painter. I hope I can find the rest of the photographs.

 

Bruce

[romberg flat]

His name was del Senno and he was a painter. I hope I can find the rest of the photographs.

 

Bruce

 

 

My interest in this “painting” is primarily because its simplicity and a sort of restraint.

On a first glance it seems that back of the violin is bird’s eye maple of very decorative structure. Human figures in dramatic move are formed only with a few strokes of brush and pen, by which the natural structure of maple is transformed into a picture.   

It does not matter if the scene depicts Apollo and Daphne or some other mythical pair, but if recipient is boosted on disclosure of the story (and I think he is), or inventing his own (like probably I did).

When this happens, decoration, a simply aesthetical category used to make object (violin) more attractive (“nicer”), gets additional meaning which justifies its use.

In one of my earlier posts in this thread I presented painting on the back of “tsunami violin” as an example of such additional, very distinctive symbolic meaning (and was slightly disappointed with the lack of comments).  

I think if there is no other reason, ornamenting violin only to distinguish it from the others, just to make it more beautiful, is completely needless, perhaps equally redundant as too much make-up on a woman’s face.   

 

Thank you, Bruce for information about the name of the painter.

I did some research and found this:

Antonio Del Senno (1845-1930) was editor and publisher of magazine “Il Violino” who made a small number of copies of classical violins.

There was also a painter Pietro Senno (1831-1905), called Del Senno, probably somehow related with the first, because they both lived and died in Pisa.

Finally, there was a painter A. Del Senno, active in 19^th C. whose paintings of historical scenes were used on numerous postcards from that time. Since the style of paintings is equal as the painting on violin, probably the word is about the same person.

 

 

He isn’t very well known nor as a violin maker, nor as a painter, but he did an extraordinary skillful decoration on that violin, IMO.

   

PS

I found on Google several postcards by A. Del Senno with scenes from Quo Vadis, novel by Sienkiewicz, what reminds me that I had some of these postcards when was a child. They must be hidden deep in one of my drawers and right now I’m going to find them.     

[Craig Tucker]

 I think if there is no other reason, ornamenting violin only to distinguish it from the others, just to make it more beautiful, is completely needless, perhaps equally redundant as too much make-up on a woman’s face.   

 

Well put romberg flat...

 

I think this says exactly what I usually see, when I see 'most attempts' at ornamentation (paintings in particular) adorning a violins exterior. Too much make up on a womans face. Something extra that's not needed or really 'an improvement', at all.

Damn well spoken!

[Ben Hebbert]

Just for fun Stephen - as it might arguably be a little off post..

 

What do you have to say for this one here?

 

[Stephen Faulk]

I can get into that much more than Arman. It reminds me of Anselm Kiefer's lead books and lead airplanes.

 

Lead has symbolic meanings and is a element in alchemy, the piece is nicely made. I like it. Is it made of tin or lead? 

[Addie]

I suspect Ben is having a bit of fun here?

[Ben Hebbert]

Moi?

[Addie]

I’m all in favor of fun, but now I really want to know what those patterns are.  The f seems a bit severe...  

[Stephen Faulk]

Maybe Ben and I are having one over on you Addie.  What is your paranoia meter reading today? 

[Addie]

How did you know I have a paranoia meter? ARE YOU SPYING ON ME?

[Ben Hebbert]

I’m all in favor of fun, but now I really want to know what those patterns are.  The f seems a bit severe...  

 

 

Regrettably, I suspect they may be from here... 

 

Stephen, can you comment on whether this undermines the artistic integrity of the aforementioned masterpiece? Do you feel any different about it now? 

 

  :)

 

 

[Stephen Faulk]

Well played Mr. Hebbert, well played indeed. 

 

Actually I don't feel different about the object, it's a Ready Made now. It just moved to the realm of Duchamp.  ZING!

 

Ever see Three Standard Stoppages? 

 

 

 

As an object it is lovely, it does not matter to me if is is not a perfect violin pattern, it is an object of wonder and interest. It looks like it has some kind of secret text encoded into it. ..........wait could it be another clue in the the mystery of the Del Gesu Code? 

[Ben Hebbert]

An interesting juxtaposition - I know that Duchamps claims that the shapes of the pieces of string are essentially random, but he has in some way curated or determined which shapes he uses so it's the artistic expression that is then rendered into standard pattern-makers forms. The reverse here, when standard pattern-maker's forms (violin templates) have been organised to resemble art.  And with both you can reproduce the essence of the work (trace the stoppage, or make a violin) over and over again! So the legitimacy of this work would seem to be profound, turning Duchamp's original principle onto itself, and achieving the same result by totally opposing means?

 

 

Duchamps, Three Standard Stoppages (MOMA) 

 

 

 

[Addie]

Well, it is actually quite a pleasing image. Even if the f template is a bit industrial.

[Stephen Faulk]

An interesting juxtaposition - I know that Duchamps claims that the shapes of the pieces of string are essentially random, but he has in some way curated or determined which shapes he uses so it's the artistic expression that is then rendered into standard pattern-makers forms. The reverse here, when standard pattern-maker's forms (violin templates) have been organised to resemble art.  And with both you can reproduce the essence of the work (trace the stoppage, or make a violin) over and over again! So the legitimacy of this work would seem to be profound, turning Duchamp's original principle onto itself, and achieving the same result by totally opposing means?

 

 

Duchamps, Three Standard Stoppages (MOMA) 

Duchamp.-Three-Standard-Stoppages-469x344.jpg1175431_245565465568122_1529420323_n.jpg

 

 

Something like that. I think you curated the photo in the context of making a mystery and that set off the templates as "art" for me. The templates were put into a context. Three Standard Stoppages I think is my favorite Duchamp piece, because he pays homage to labor, eye hand work, and chance all at the same time. And more. 

 

A Jannis Kounellis kind of presentation or an Arte Povera "curation" of the violin templates would work too.  Leaving the templates on a simple table to highlight them or some other basic display. I think the objects have intrinsic value and what I call "good objectness" some objects just have a lot of cultural meanings because they intersect with our thoughts and feelings in so many ways, and some objects have a palpable "vibe". Violins have that vibe, you know what I mean? Why do some violins just call you over from across the room and some don't? You say to yourself, well this violin is not much in terms of how much money it could be worth or how well made or even value historically, so it's not a real high priority, yet you can't stop looking at it. It has some vitality that is unexplainable. It left the makers hand and he or she imparted it with some volumetric magic by the way they worked on it. 

 

Duchamp understands this and plays upon it both intellectually and physically, but I think other kinds of art works because the artist curates objects into a context which emphasizes the vitality of the object and provokes it to speak further, far beyond what it literally is. The art part is fueled by a dialectic set up between the context the artist curates the object into and the objects inherent vibe and cultural associations; the context plus object equals a new set of meanings. A classic dialectic. Much work made this way operates due to the artists own sensitivity and heightened awareness of the they objects they choose, and a need, love of, or desire to show how the objects transform them personally. Fred Wilson comes to mind here. He goes into museum storage rooms and selects objects to be recontexualized in displays on the museum main floor in such a way that they provoke striking associations. He is more in a sense like Duchamp, using an intellectual narrative more than an "objectness", beauty vibe or admiration for plain beauty to drive the work.  

 

Arte Povera works have a social drive behind them, but I think in many ways they can be taken as straight up beauty, the vibe of the object sings out because the context the object  shown in is stripped down or stripped out of everything possible that would interfere with the beauty of the object. The art of getting rid of everything non intrinsic to the way the object is put into context. Maybe it just needs to pinned to a wall to set it off. The way something is displayed can make it speak in a new way and this is about concise editorship, and it's not easy. The artist puts an object into a display of some kind and by doing that it makes a transformation. 

I think a of of Beuys' works hit on this too, but his are backed by a personal narrative and mythology that gives his objects second and third meanings.

 

The violin templates work  'as is' and only need a little nudge into a setting where they can be seen in subtle contrast with the setting to make them show second and third meanings.  A photograph of them is enough to create a kind of stage for them. Duchamps Three Stoppages is self contained, it's a set and he gives it a traveling case which makes it have a surveyors kit feeling or a tool kit vibe. The case provides the context. The Stoppage templates themselves would not so interesting without the case. 

 

The violin templates are more open at this point, they have potential, but have not be "taken" by any one artist. By taken I mean that one could not make something with them without most everyone seeing an association with a certain artist who has already made an important work with them. Like a sled is almost always taken by Joseph Beuys and it is difficult to make a sled without viewers making a reference to Beuys. Or to get more obscure, putting a plain wooden chair in a room is almost a sure reference to Joseph Kosuth, but thankfully we can get away with a chair easier than a sled because Kosuth is not as well known to most viewers. 

 

Fred Wilson works less with the physical vibe of the object than with the cultural vibe. But his work is very fluid in the sense that once he "takes" and object it can be returned to a regular sort of value in your mind, the objects he places in contexts are juxtapositions of things that normally would not rest side by side in a glass case, but when they do they throw sparks off one another and the tableaux is super powerful. Once the objects are taken away from each other they can return to other meanings, but for a sensitive person you will still carry some of Wilson's associations away with you. His work works because it shows you ways to curate objects yourself mentally and this changes the way you see the world. Duchamp does the same thing, but he is more hermetically sealed, hard to get into because he has layers of insider knowledge you have to learn in order to be initiated into his world. Wilson takes you as you are and brings you into his world or way of making connections between objects. 

 

So I guess I'm saying all this to mean that there are dozens of ways to "curate" an object into being a work of art. Duchamp is the granddaddy of context because he invented the game, but he was kind enough and smart enough to not lock down the rules. However, some artists who think the context game is easy can look derivative of Duchamp and be labeled as Duchampian, the best artists resist this labeling because they are good. Duchamp did not take the genre, but many artists fall into cliches or ways of doing context art which become formulaic and dead. Arman ring a bell? 

 

Two last thoughts, sometimes I think that some artists get so good at making these kinds of pieces that the facility they have and the money they have to make slick works often causes them lose the grit of earlier work. There is contextualizing an object into art and way to be intuitive and meaningful and away to rest on ones past works and reproduce style without a lot of meaning. Which only means that art making at that level is not easy. 

 

Here is one of Wilson's pieces, from a show or series called "Mining the Museum" where he takes objects from different sections of the museum or object storage rooms and places them together in one case. In this one slave shackles and a silver tea service are set side by side. 

[Stephen Faulk]

Now, with all that has been said about context, how does one place an image on a violin in such a way that it creates something more than just a violin with a painting on it?

 

Like how can an image and a violin come together to create something that is a third object?  

 

Not easy is it. 

[Craig Tucker]

 

Simply put - most all "adornment" comes in a distant second to the adornment of nature, that most people want or expect to see, on a violin.

 

Agreed.

[Stephen Faulk]

At least you agree with yourself. This must save you hours and hours of self talking. I envy you. 

[Craig Tucker]

At least you agree with yourself. This must save you hours and hours of self talking. I envy you. 

But... 

 

but...

 

we said almost the same thing there.

[Craig Tucker]

What do you paint on a violin, that makes it an improvement for the violin?

 

Mostly, nothing.