Washing linseed oil

[JohnCockburn]

For what it's worth I'm also in the camp of the great unwashed.

[Jim Bress]

I may join the unwashed crowd in the future, but as long as I'm washing I might well do a good job while I'm at it.

-Jim

[Michael_Molnar]

Jim,

Check Tad Spurgeon for great information about linseed oil.

IIRC, you need to "burn" off the wax if you do not wash the oil.

I used to wash my Swedish linseed oil until I discovered Varnish Maker's Linseed Oil.  This is cleaner and works. 

[Jim Bress]

52 minutes ago, Michael_Molnar said:

Jim,

Check Tad Spurgeon for great information about linseed oil.

IIRC, you need to "burn" off the wax if you do not wash the oil.

I used to wash my Swedish linseed oil until I discovered Varnish Maker's Linseed Oil.  This is cleaner and works. 

Thanks Mike.  Now you have it in writing that I "heard" you.

-Jim

[Kimmo89]

Week has gone, and I see no diffirence in colour or anything else.

The one in left is how it looks after setting for 24 hours.

I have changed the water every time before shaking.

It looks like orange limonade, not clear.

Its Allbäck raw linseed oil from sweden.

Should I throw this away or will I try more?

 

Is the cold pressed linseed oil from Kremer for artist use?

http://shop.kremerpigments.com/en/mediums-binders-und-glues/oils/natural-oils/5806/linseed-oil-cold-pressed

 

[Davide Sora]

 

This is how it appeared after about fifteen days and since the last change of water, changed in total three times, with a lot of agitation between one exchange and another.

The oil is Kremer 73020 cold pressed, I don't know the difference with 73054 that you indicated, to me seems the same thing but really don't know.

The oil never become really transparent due to slight water content, but is clearly more clear than yours.

Once poured off, the slight cloudiness disappear after taking it slightly above 100° C to drive off the water.

[Jim Bress]

Kimmo89, Yours looks better than mine.  The stuff freshly shaken (3 jars on the right) look the same as mine right after I shake, but yours settled much cleaner (left bottle).    I shook the my bottles once a day for a week, then let it settle for a week.  I took the "clean" stuff off the top and ended with 250 ml of my starting volume of 1 L.  That felt like too much waste for me.  So I broke out my centrifuge and spun the goopy dross.  I was able to recover another 300 ml.  I'm in my second week of shaking with much less dross.  I'll let it settle for another week starting Friday then I'll probably cook off the en-trained water as Davide described.

Davide,  Is all the white stuff just from the oil or did you add stuff like salt and sand?  Do you remove any unwanted junk along the way or just let it all settle?

Thanks,

Jim

Sorry for the blurry pics.

Before centrifuge

After centrifuge

 

[Jim Bress]

I'm also wondering if I should "break" the oil as described in this thread.  https://maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328133-breaking-vs-washing-linseed-oil/&

If a jobs worth doing...

Thanks,

Jim

[Michael_Molnar]

You guys are not reading the article. You are making a water-oil emulsion. Add lots of salt and pool sand to extract the white wax and consolidate the oil.

[Jim Bress]

18 minutes ago, Michael_Molnar said:

You guys are not reading the article. You are making a water-oil emulsion. Add lots of salt and pool sand to extract the white wax and consolidate the oil.

Nope, I was following Roger's directions.  The next race may be run with the product you suggested from WFE.  But I need to finish this race with the horse I'm riding.

-Jim

[Kimmo89]

Nice looking oil Davide.

Maybe next I will try the oil you are using.

 

If I understood it right, hard water causes more trapped water or oil. White thing in the jars and bottles?

I have noticed earlier, that the water at my summer place, where I am right now, is very soft.

Dont know if soft or hard water is better for washing linseed oil.

 

I will then continue trying to wash my oils another week and lets see how it looks then.

It will look much clearer, when I add new hot water for it, but I think its not telling anything yet.

[Don Noon]

22 hours ago, Michael_Molnar said:

I used to wash my Swedish linseed oil until I discovered Varnish Maker's Linseed Oil.  This is cleaner and works. 

I use the WFE oil too, and it works fine.  I have a mostly-empty bottle in the shop, unrefrigerated, which I got a year or two ago, and there's nothing wrong with it.  I have also used Ultrecht artist's oil, and even some food-grade walnut oil (very slow to dry, but eventually got there; linseed is better).  There's plenty of other things to diddle with without fussing with the oil too.

4 pages and counting on variations of linseed oil and washing; it's starting to remind me of artisanal firewood.

[Davide Sora]

3 hours ago, Jim Bress said:

Kimmo89, Yours looks better than mine.  The stuff freshly shaken (3 jars on the right) look the same as mine right after I shake, but yours settled much cleaner (left bottle).    I shook the my bottles once a day for a week, then let it settle for a week.  I took the "clean" stuff off the top and ended with 250 ml of my starting volume of 1 L.  That felt like too much waste for me.  So I broke out my centrifuge and spun the goopy dross.  I was able to recover another 300 ml.  I'm in my second week of shaking with much less dross.  I'll let it settle for another week starting Friday then I'll probably cook off the en-trained water as Davide described.

Davide,  Is all the white stuff just from the oil or did you add stuff like salt and sand?  Do you remove any unwanted junk along the way or just let it all settle?

I add only salt to the water, not sand, and I don't remove the white junk between washings. At the end, after removing most of the oil, I continued to add water and shake for at least a month to see if I could recover as much oil as possible from the white junk (as Ted Spurgeon recommend) and in fact something goes on coming out even if not much.

Is a very slow process, decanting need a very long time, it takes a lot of patience but there really is no need to hasten the times, just start a year before.....

 

 

 

[piaffe]

Tad Spurgeon's salt refined oil method is what I used for making artist's oil. Here are two versions I made in early 2015.  They've been in a sunny window for the last 2 1/2 years.

[Guest]

I will be washing 10L of linseed and it will only take a few days to get crystal clear oil.

-One word of caution...be extremely careful when heating the cloudy oil to drive out the water. Keep the temp below the boiling point of water or it will explode violently and you will have hot oil everywhere. Driving the water out turns the oil clear. Or you can let it sit on a sunny window sill but that takes a long time. You can count on losing almost half of the oil because of all the junk that is removed.

[Kimmo89]

Sunny windows...

 

Maybe I have to buy another place from southern europe just so I can prepare linseed oil.

 

You all seem to live in places where sun shines always and around the year.

 

We had sunny days in Finland too this summer. Couple days.

[Guest]

51 minutes ago, Kimmo89 said:

Sunny windows...

Maybe I have to buy another place from southern europe just so I can prepare linseed oil.

You all seem to live in places where sun shines always and around the year.

We had sunny days in Finland too this summer. Couple days.

...

You don't need the sun to clear the oil. You can  heat slowly and gently to clear the oil. Just keep the temp below the boiling point of water (212F). Try a small amount for the first time to get a feel for it.. Not too deep in the pan. The best time to wash is summer or in a warm heated shop.  I also use the Allback raw Swedish oil.

Good Stuff.

[Jim Bress]

3 hours ago, Don Noon said:

I use the WFE oil too, and it works fine.  I have a mostly-empty bottle in the shop, unrefrigerated, which I got a year or two ago, and there's nothing wrong with it.  I have also used Ultrecht artist's oil, and even some food-grade walnut oil (very slow to dry, but eventually got there; linseed is better).  There's plenty of other things to diddle with without fussing with the oil too.

4 pages and counting on variations of linseed oil and washing; it's starting to remind me of artisanal firewood.

Thanks for seconding Mike's recommendation.  When you don't know what you don't know you worry about everything, or is that when you know you don't know? 

4 pages and still on topic is even more amazing.

-Jim

[Jim Bress]

2 hours ago, Davide Sora said:

I add only salt to the water, not sand, and I don't remove the white junk between washings. At the end, after removing most of the oil, I continued to add water and shake for at least a month to see if I could recover as much oil as possible from the white junk (as Ted Spurgeon recommend) and in fact something goes on coming out even if not much.

Is a very slow process, decanting need a very long time, it takes a lot of patience but there really is no need to hasten the times, just start a year before.....

 

 

 

 

Switching to oil from spirit varnish was a surprise I didn't see coming.  Hard to plan in advance for that.   Thanks for the reply.

-Jim

[Jim Bress]

On 8/15/2017 at 11:07 AM, Michael_Molnar said:

Jim,

Check Tad Spurgeon for great information about linseed oil.

IIRC, you need to "burn" off the wax if you do not wash the oil.

I used to wash my Swedish linseed oil until I discovered Varnish Maker's Linseed Oil.  This is cleaner and works. 

Because I'm a curious sort, and theirs the possibility that I'll ruin my oil while drying and breaking (attempt breaking) it, I called Dale and asked about the Varnish Maker's Linseed Oil.  The Break is done with an alkali solution, then washed to remove the alkali and clean the oil, then dried with something that absorbs the water (he wasn't sure and I forgot his guess).  All of it done without heat starting from cold pressed oil.  Anyway I ordered a quart for back up in case I screw things up or if my end product doesn't look as good.

Cheers,

Jim

[Michael_Molnar]

Here is another great site with wonderful photos about washing linseed oil.  

Don Jusko is a first class artist and gave me some great information about dichromatic pigments. 

 

[Kimmo89]

Yes.

 

I dont really know how much my soft water cleans the oil, but there seems to be difference in colour.

The one at the right is not yet warmed, its how the oil looks when it sets for a day in a little layer. The left is the original colour.

Is this how it supposed to look?

I will order this same oil to my home too and try what happens with a real harder water.

 

 

[Jim Bress]

Hi Kimmo89, No experts jumping in so I'll answer.  I think they both look fine for varnish.  I spread a thin film on a glass dish and stuck it in my UV box.  I think if your film dries it's good to make varnish out of it.  My oil ended up between the color of your two samples the test film and the varnish I made afterwards dries fine.

Cheers,

Jim

[go_oa]

If you really want fresh squeezed oil : http://www.oilpress.co/

https://www.ifsbulk.com/search?Q=flax+seed&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIxKbagrWH1gIVF7XACh0I2QTOEAAYASAAEgJ33fD_BwE

 

$10,000 foe the press.  less than a dollar/Pound  for seeds.  

Squeeze your own and control the refining!!

[Peter K-G]

Kimmo,

Some years ago I tested linseed oil for my varnish cooking, domestic linseed oil was the best (Wanha viljami, sateenkaari värit)

If you cook it for 4-5 hours in a double boiler, standing on a piece of wood (see last image) you will get a very siccative oil for your varnish, that cures with minimal UV.

The color is not that important, it will get transparent in half a year to one year without UV anyway and has no influence on varnish drying time.