Sizing with Casein & Hydraulic Lime

[Peter K-G]

New topic, same issues

 

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328692-sealing-with-diluted-hide-glue/

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328546-darkening-the-violin-wood/

 

Patrick Kreit:

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328546-darkening-the-violin-wood/page-4#entry588363

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328546-darkening-the-violin-wood/page-6#entry588584

 

Roger Hargrave (this is the best practical advice on how to use plaster):

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328014-making-a-double-bass/?view=findpost&p=585941

(looks a little bit scary)

 

I have no interest in cooking the soup myself, just want to by the chemicals, mix and apply and succeed with the first time.

Hope someone can give some precise and practical advice on how to use Casein & Lime (Fomage frais can not be found in stores where I live, and I don't won't to cook) plus direct opinions on products/Chemicals to use:

 

http://www.kremer-pigmente.com/en/mediums--binders-und-glues/water-soluble-binders/mediums-und-natural-gums/casein-63200.html

+

http://www.kremer-pigmente.com/en/fillers-und-building-materials/limes/pit-lime-31800.html

 

Good or Bad ?

 

How to?

[FiddleDoug]

"just want to by the chemicals, mix and apply and succeed with the first time."

 

Peter,

The above may not happen. I suggest trying your mix and methods out on some test panels before committing an instrument to it.

[pbelin]

Ok here's how I prepare the casein for that: I take about 300ml warm water from the tap, put a soup spoon of casein in it. (The one from kremer)

It swells very quickly. ( in cold water it works too but you need more patience and I don't have that tool…)

Then I add about the same amount of lime, stir well. Something happens you'll see.

Let it settle,filter it, however you want to get rid of the white opaque stuff.

I brush it,wipe off the excess, let it dry, 2, 3, or more times depending on my mood.

Good luck!

I would like to know if there a way to lower the pH of that without it precipitating? Any idea anyone?

[LinkMan]

Masters casein emulsion ground Started by violins88, Jun 09 2009 06:27 AM

[Melvin Goldsmith]

New topic, same issues

 

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328692-sealing-with-diluted-hide-glue/

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328546-darkening-the-violin-wood/

 

Patrick Kreit:

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328546-darkening-the-violin-wood/page-4#entry588363

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328546-darkening-the-violin-wood/page-6#entry588584

 

Roger Hargrave (this is the best practical advice on how to use plaster):

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?/topic/328014-making-a-double-bass/?view=findpost&p=585941

(looks a little bit scary)

 

I have no interest in cooking the soup myself, just want to by the chemicals, mix and apply and succeed with the first time.

Hope someone can give some precise and practical advice on how to use Casein & Lime (Fomage frais can not be found in stores where I live, and I don't won't to cook) plus direct opinions on products/Chemicals to use:

 

http://www.kremer-pigmente.com/en/mediums--binders-und-glues/water-soluble-binders/mediums-und-natural-gums/casein-63200.html

+

http://www.kremer-pigmente.com/en/fillers-und-building-materials/limes/pit-lime-31800.html

 

Good or Bad ?

 

How to?

I think a lot of people will have investigated all of this at great time and expense to themselves along the way to a solution. ....I am sure that some of them will be able to provide a recommendation involving lime 

[Patrick KREIT]

Peter KG

 

Even if imported French fromage blanc is not available, an equivalent local product should be.

 

fromage blanc / fromage frais

Quark in German; also Weißkäse; Topfen in Bavaria and Austria

Kwark / plattekaas in Dutch

Kvark in Danish

Kvarg in Swedish and Norwegian

Twaróg in Polish

queso batido de leche de vaca in Spanish

coalhada in Portuguese

Творо́г также допустимое ударение in Russian*

τυρί in Greek

lor in Turkish

 

Source:  Clicking on the name of the different foreign languages in the left-margin bar of this site:

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fromage_blanc

 

The important thing is to use a fat-free, additive-free product.

 

www.kreitpatrick.com

[Peter K-G]

I didn't realize that Fromage blanc was just Kvarq

Didn't search and imagined it was some special French product, have to test that too.

 

Is this the right lime to use:

http://www.kremer-pi...lime-31800.html

[Patrick KREIT]

Peter, to make sizing with casein, you need to make the glue yourself -- nothing else!  You must make an emulsion of the glue with linseed oil or with varnish (the latter containing colophany or mastic drops, or both: 2/3 colophany and 1/3 mastic drops).

Casein made with lime is preferable. However, you should proceed with great care because of the pH and the reaction with the wood. The complete recipe is in the second edition of my book. 

 

 

Kremer's lime is appropriate to use.

 

www.kreitpatrick.com

 

 

 

[Peter K-G]

I'm studying varnish components and products and my brain is turning into a chemical mess

 

So the industry puts millions of euros burning and destilling the pine tree, to make thousands of different commersial products with hundreds of different names (spirit of turpentine, gum turpentine, balsamturpentine, rectified... Colophony, rosin made from resin... you name it) Totally impossible for a first timer to decide what to buy.

 

http://apps.kemi.se/flodessok/floden/kemamne_eng/kolofonium_eng.htm

 

Just so we can boil/heat it and mix it back together and blend it with linseed oil (another similar story of millions of different products) to make fine violin varnish

 

Why not just:

http://www.wikihow.com/Tap-a-Pine-Tree

 

Back to - I want to buy a ready to use product on bottle... but hey wait a minute, there is no such thing either

 

=> Violin makers are doomed to be chemists