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Real Cappa?


GoldenPlate

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Far to nice for ebay! My first reaction was to run through the early 18th. C. Austrian & S. Tirolean (yes) makers, but that is diffucult, since so many have been re-chrisened Italian, that there aren’t enough left to have a reliable reference sample. I can’t remember now, who told me that Cappa’s don’t normally have labels, and I think this one is a case for the Mn graphology department. Curiously he writes:

"Once It was an instrument of very large proportions from what I understand, and as a result 'f" holes were reshaped later on... The top may have been replaced with a Tyrollean School high arching top dating back about 250 years ago according to Rene Morel who looked at the instrument 3-4 years ago”

which doesn’t make any sense to me.

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I'd love to read the certificate from Millant. Cappas are extremely rare, the only cello I saw was back in the 80's at Moennig. It was a lot more gold than this instrument, (not that that's particularly meaningful...) and was *bought out from under me* by a teacher at Eastman,(whose name escapes me)

Interesting that the seller has sold Mercedes rims and a carbon fibre racing bicycle too, plus tons of bows. If this is a real Cappa he's seriously underpricing it.

* Not really, but it sounds good...

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Millant certificate states

"is an authentic instrument of Gofr.....etc ... with an original label, it's a good example of this author/maker

one piece maple back, weak flame

ribs of the same wood

head maple, medium flame more pronounced

table in two pieces, spruce fine grained in the middle, broadening towards the flanks"

One spelling mistake, otherwise the French is very correct.

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If the papers are from Millant, shouldn't that be satisfactory as to the maker of the violin? I'm certainly no expert, and even I recognize the famous name.

Does the certificate mention anything about condition, originality, etc? I don't understand why this is such an issue for MN. Why "Is this a real Cappa"?

(parenthetically, the cellist who bought the Cappa from Moennig back in the 80's was Steve Doane, then a professor at Eastman. At some point I was informed that he had gone on to another instrument, and so had presumably traded it in.)

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Yes the certificate says it's genuine (post 6 for a translantion). But is the certificate genuine, and if it is, does it belong to the violin?

I think looking at certificates is a bit like looking at labels, in other words they might corroborate one's own opinion but are not in themselves evidence of anything.

The consensus so far seems to be that the certificate is wrong.

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If the papers are from Millant, shouldn't that be satisfactory as to the maker of the violin? I'm certainly no expert, and even I recognize the famous name.

Does the certificate mention anything about condition, originality, etc? I don't understand why this is such an issue for MN. Why "Is this a real Cappa"?

The classic “jail bait”; far to cheap for a real Cappa, far to expensive for an early 18th. C. Austrian with a fake italian label.

Should you consider Millant to have god-like infallibility, you will have little alternative than to hurry up and click on “Buy it now”, won't you! :)

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Thanks, I understand the issue now. Maybe I was misled because my papers from Moennig have 3 identifying pictures.

As to the cello, I was surprised to learn Mr. Doane traded it, especially because Moennig mentioned it had only been owned by 3 different families in its entire existence.

(Of course, how they might have known that could be up for speculation...)

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Guys, guys, hang on a minute - the Millant certificate states categorically that the violin to which it belongs has an original label (portant l'etiquette originale). There is absolutely no way that the label in this fiddle could be mistaken for an original one (I'll save you the handwriting analysis - in my experience, he prints his labels). There also appears to be no photos on the certificate. On that basis, there really is no discussion. Its an old violin made to match an old certificate that's become detached from another instrument in order to fool someone.

The seller writes "Also, I prefer instruments without cracks or repairs. A violin that had survived 80-100 years without cracking is worth my attention. Every instrument in my collection had gone through a rigorous audition. " Just for fun, who wants to play 'count-the-crack? For what its worth, I count a dozen nasty dirty ones on the belly. Maybe its OK as an ebay description if they are all over 100 years old?

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Fighting words Ben!

I wouldn't recognize a Cappa if you hit me in the face with it, but it's not necessary to see the pictures to know the violin isn't one in the opinion of the seller.

In general, I think one can safely reject the authenticity of anything on Ebay about which the seller says "I cannot claim or confirm for sure its authenticity".

Specifically, the language very carefully slides around the issues and suggests that the violin is "part Cappa" without actually claiming this. The last paragraph text is also generic and doesn't actually refer directly to the violin in question. The seller prefers instruments without cracks - he doesn't refer to the violin itself, in fact the grammar breaks down entirely in the last few short sentences in order to create the impression of saying things that are not actually being said.

Slippery text, very well constructed ... say no more.

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I can’t remember now, who told me that Cappa’s don’t normally have labels, and I think this one is a case for the Mn graphology department. Curiously he writes:

Jacob, Another case of 'I can't remember who told me', but quite a few genuine Cappas have Amati labels in them, but the font turns out to be the same as on the few genuine Cappa labels that survive.

Cappa is a complete nightmare - in the early 19th century he was rated in French violin literature consistently as the fourth great Classical Italian maker - so there was huge demand for his instruments. Problem is that someone stuck in Saluzzo in the 1690s didn't exactly have a huge market, so a large number of equivalent minor Italian makers working without a mould and to an Amati pattern tend to turn up with Cappa attributions or fake labels, yet still being perfectly valid 17th century Italian violins. Really nice Dutch things also tend to get the Cappa treatment as well. I'm not comparing this violin to a Cappa - for a Cappa you really have to think of an Amati gone wrong, rather than something which - by those standards - hasn't gone right at all!

Ben

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This is very obviously not a Cappa. Nothing is right here. F, outline and scroll don't even come close to a Cappa.

The Cappas I have seen all had a very particular scroll, different model with open c-bouts, long corners. The f holes are different too.

It's just a nice looking fiddle.

I am astonished nobody spotted this yet.

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