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Seeking infomation on old violin


Oliver R

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I think some of these very exaggerated archings were actually formed by pressing in a mould rather than carving.

I don`t.

I would also date this fiddle earlier than you Martin, since this technique petered out at the begining of the centuary. It was made in the Schönbach cottage industry tradition by some poor devil who got paid next to nothing for it, which is about what it is still worth.

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I don`t.

I would also date this fiddle earlier than you Martin, since this technique petered out at the begining of the centuary. It was made in the Schönbach cottage industry tradition by some poor devil who got paid next to nothing for it, which is about what it is still worth.

Interesting! I, like Martin (fellow Academy delinquent), thought these “air brush” shaded violins were 1930’s.

(I hope I don’t get demerits for pontificating... :D )

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Dear Teach, please clarify .....

You don't think these exaggerated archings used a mould, but if they did it was pre-1900, so this violin, which didn't use that technique, must be pre-1900 ....?

I must be missing something.

I concede that the violin may be late 19th century, and the scroll is definitely "monkey with a mallet" - however, the varnish does look pretty industrial and a more modern "sunburst" effect. That and the artificiality of the back arching made me think it was later ...

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This violin, which is a “cheapest of the range” has the earlier system of rib manufacture which we have discussed x times, which dates it. The belly (unless it hs been regraduated) would have a crude carved bar, which alone would make the suggestion that it had been pressed, ridiculous. That the coloured varnish has shot into the end/short grain area of the belly (left & right of the tailpiece) tells you that it hasn`t been pressed too.

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this is the exact opposite of a pressed violin, which, oweing to how difficult it is to press into shape, would have very little exaggerated curve at the edge, and not too high an arching either IMO in other words it would look rather flat, not highly curved, i think martin needs to go back to adding, "but i am not an expert" to his "appraisals"........

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I've seen Bohemian violins with pressed tops that had the most extreme "arching" imaginable, with a kind of diagonal kink just outside the lines of the f-holes and mirrored on the back arching too.

Pressed plates are finished by hand at the edges ... don't see any operational reason why both can't co-exist.

IMHO not an expert by the way :blink:

Lyndon, last time you laid into me it was for allegedly shadowing Jacob and agreeing with his appraisals!

I think you're trying to make a mountain out of a molehill.

But we're all saying it's a cheap trade Schoenbach instrument, and arguing about 30 years (either side of about 1910). I still feel the varnish is more modern than 1890 but I bow to Jacob's experience.

BTW I was trying to introduce the idea to the original poster that his/her violin wasn't valuable or unusual. I don't see the need to be rude and insulting in these situations ....the violin is not "worth nothing", it's just not something a violin dealer would take a second look at.

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I've seen Bohemian violins with pressed tops that had the most extreme "arching" imaginable, with a kind of diagonal kink just outside the lines of the f-holes and mirrored on the back arching too.

Pressed plates are finished by hand at the edges ... don't see any operational reason why both can't co-exist.

Funny, I havn`t seen any.

Are you getting mixed up with JTL and other frogs? (who`s bent arches are less extreem for obvious reasons, as Lyndon said)

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no ... early 20th century Bohemian "factory" violins, generally with Klotz labels, I'll see if I can find some photos<br>I get your point about the short grain and the colour absorbtion - nice tip. It doesn't happen with maple because it's less porous?<br><br>Here's the sort of thing I was talking about - is this pressed? I always assumed so, but I suppose I just couldn't imagine anyone would carve something so ugly ....<br>post-34919-0-82567900-1336853638_thumb.jpg<br>post-34919-0-44723600-1336853649_thumb.jpg<br>post-34919-0-58469900-1336853662_thumb.jpg<br>

hm don't know what happened to that post!

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well now im shadowing you for making amateur appraisals, then argueing with the expert when he corrects you, wood will only bend so far without splitting, obviously the person that told you those bohemian violins were pressed didnt know what they were talking about...

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no ... early 20th century Bohemian "factory" violins, generally with Klotz labels, I'll see if I can find some photos

I get your point about the short grain and the colour absorbtion - nice tip. It doesn't happen with maple because it's less porous?

I am not aware of "bohemian" (normaly means Schönbach) violins with pressed plates, and would almost be prepared to eat deepfried mars bar if you show me one

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Lyndon ...

My "appraisal" was hardly outrageous. Same place, roughly same period, same value ....

You will also note that I didn't say the top was pressed - I said I thought some of these exaggerated archings were done that way. What's with you guys?

And I'm not arguing with the expert I'm arguing with you. I'm attempting to learn something from the expert!

Try telling a chair maker they can only bend wood so far ....

Jacob, will I batter up the Mars Bar ...?

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I am not aware of "bohemian" (normaly means Schönbach) violins with pressed plates, and would almost be prepared to eat deepfried mars bar if you show me one

Jacob,

Are you aware that deep fried mars bars are a much desired American delicacy, requiring no coercion to be eaten in large qualities?

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This is a trade violin from the 1930s ... generally I've seen these with a "Stradivarius, Made in Czechoslovakia" label.

lets get back to what you originally said, which is rather outrageous, you didnt say looks like 1930s, or ive seen instruments from the 1930s that look like this, you said this violin is from the 1930s end of sentence(not 1929, not 1940), how could you be so sure of the date, obviously youre not so sure, youre just trying to sound authoratative, when its the real authorities that try to make careful statements like i outlined above, add to that that this model if labeled would usually would have a stainer label, not a strad label, and youre wrong on two out of three counts, the only thing youre right about is its a trade violin, and even addie could have told us that.......

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.... and even addie could have told us that.......

Thanks, I think. But I also thought 1930’s, because of the “airbrush” look. I would like to know, and I think it would be useful for all who deal with Mark-Schön trade instruments, when the airbrush look shows up.

Martin, have you ever had a frozen Snickers bar? An American thing...

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