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H.R.Fisher

antiquing new violin

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I would like to try my hand at antiquing a violin.I need resources,information,opinions your techniques etc.

thank you all in advance for your response. Henry

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I would like to try my hand at antiquing a violin.I need resources,information,opinions your techniques etc.

thank you all in advance for your response. Henry

antiquing ,,,questions, loved and played ,or rode hard and put away wet? 50,100, or 300 yrs old? look for agreements,between what you have and what you want,the best advice I've heard on the subject go something like this..."Do 10% of what you think you need"......then consider again what you think you need, I've heard stories of fakers actually breaking,and then repairing stuff! I've always been drawn to older looking new stuff,but It's very hard to do convincingly. think about what causes the wear and tear we so admire....If you do any abrasive work ...start with the finest grits ,nothing is more distracting than scratches,in a uniform pattern. you could try lending the violin to a player for a bit....I agree with Ben's statement to try and find a person to work with,

I understand that in a recent exhibition of new works in NYC, that the majority of makers had done antiquing to some extent,says something about the validity of working in that direction.

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I haven't seen any of Roger Hargraves work first hand, only photos, but from what everyone says he's well able to produce a spot on likeness of the instrument he's copying. I believe his ability to do this is down to a combination of his violin making skills, a background in fine art and his natural ability to get a good likeness of whatever he copies, like a good portrait painter who can catch the exact likeness of their subject. IMHO antiquing and copying properly is a complex skill involving several disciplines which can take years to master.

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I would like to try my hand at antiquing a violin.I need resources,information,opinions your techniques etc.

thank you all in advance for your response. Henry

Henry,

I think eye training and restraint are the first 2 rules.

Find details that attract your eye....books, posters, other people's [contemporary] instruments [come to VSA for the competition]....above all make an effort to see good varnish on good [old] instruments.

Practice. Get a vso and try to match your varnishing technique to the details you like. [i have an old beater vso that I probably varnished 200 times before I told anyone I wanted to learn to varnish instruments.] I find adding detail as you go along is far easier to control than fully varnishing and then abrading the surface.

When you get to your own instrument, be restrained. THE RULE...as I was instructed: Figure out what you want to do with your antiquing and do 10% of it....then, maybe you will have not done too much.

on we go,

Joe

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rudall   

Strads were made to look new, with no antiquing.

That is often said - and always with reference to Strad. Why not Amati or Bergonzi?

And is it not only an assumption?

Andrew

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Will L   

There are a lot of books on making. Has anyone ever written a book on antiquing? If not, there's a need begging to be filled. I'd buy it.

I'm only quoting myself to get the question out there again.

I think the woodworking aspects of violin-making are well enough covered, varnish not so well, and antiquing NOT AT ALL.

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I'm only quoting myself to get the question out there again.

I think the woodworking aspects of violin-making are well enough covered, varnish not so well, and antiquing NOT AT ALL.

Yes, I agree. Except to say that antiquing IS covered "out there" - but not NEARLY as much as the more mundane aspects of making and varnishing. I believe that the area is one where many makers would rather hold what they have learned "closer to their vests" than usual - but have heart, there is still much there if you really search.

And, when asking about antiquing modern instruments, it does not usually bode well for getting answers, if the discussion branches off into a discussion about "whether Strad did it" or not. It's a question that begs an unending thread loaded with diverse opinions.

I was going to post my first experiences with finding my way into this area, (of antiquing - which I posted here) but I cannot get the answer (or find the thread) by using the search function yet...

I'll look again as soon as I get back.

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AndreaA   
My link I would also like more information on antiquing but have yet to find anything good .Many people do not like antiquing but for someone as myself who does not have many connections or money to own a fine old instrument this is as close as i will ever be to having something that resembles a famous makers violin.I have seen many makers antiqued instruments and some are better than others .I would describe my own attempts to antique as a exaggeration or a caricature of what i think these violins look like.I hope to be able to get very close to the original someday but it is hard unless you can examine these in person .I am impressed by the Roger Hansell varnish work very much so .What would be some of the top makers who do the best antique work?

post-31233-0-91761600-1328281956_thumb.jpg

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I like this violin posted by a forum member, Matthias Lange, he said he antiqued the varnish simply with alcohol, see the thread, and the pics are amazing

http://www.maestronet.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=324875

I remember this thread - I agree, amazing work.

I'm glad that this topic is heating up a bit. It is an area where many posters (new makers in particular, perhaps) need a bit of an encouragement, because, even "straight" varnishing of violins has many problems that need to be learned before violin-like results are gotten.

Antiquing - even more so.

At least that's how it was for me.

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Many people do not like antiquing but for someone as myself who does not have many connections or money to own a fine old instrument this is as close as i will ever be to having something that resembles a famous makers violin.I have seen many makers antiqued instruments and some are better than others .I would describe my own attempts to antique as a exaggeration or a caricature of what i think these violins look like.I hope to be able to get very close to the original someday but it is hard unless you can examine these in person .I am impressed by the Roger Hansell varnish work very much so .What would be some of the top makers who do the best antique work?

I agree, that "many people do not like antiquing", but really, so what?

- many people will not like anything you'd care to bring up.

I also agree - (though my photos are no longer up on the link for the thread I posted here) - that my own attempts at antiquing look very contrived to me as you have pointed out, and yet, I still choose to continue to go down the "antiquing road" simply because it interests me. (and my customers).

You can satisfy your own interests and let the interests of those who do not agree with you or with your ideas and opinions, to themselves.

Also in my opinion, the greater the difficulty - the more persistent I become. In the end, I have discovered that there are virtually no “secrets “ left to violin making out there, there are only proprietary methods and even those are a dime a dozen. This is particularly true with regard to varnishing - of any ilk - it's all out there, free for the taking, if you look hard enough.

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