Strad Plans f-holes

[violins88]

I am using the Strad plans to make a Conte Vitali viola. I am finally cutting the f-holes. The plan specifies 75mm from the middle of upper eye to middle of lower eye. However the drawing is not to scale on this fact, so one cannot use the drawing as a template. Is this a common mistake on the Strad drawings? How do people handle this? It is too late for this viola because I have already cut the eyes. But maybe for the next violin or viola, I can do something different.

Thanks

[Craig Tucker]

I am using the Strad plans to make a Conte Vitali viola. I am finally cutting the f-holes. The plan specifies 75mm from the middle of upper eye to middle of lower eye. However the drawing is not to scale on this fact, so one cannot use the drawing as a template. Is this a common mistake on the Strad drawings? How do people handle this? It is too late for this viola because I have already cut the eyes. But maybe for the next violin or viola, I can do something different.

Thanks

I have always used a proportional wheel (a cheap plastic slide rule/scale, used in graphic design - to quickly size photos and drawings in order to enlarge or reduce them to fit an appropriate size space) then Xerox the original ff hole drawing to the appropriate size, then spray mount the back of the xerox paper and mount it on to a piece of plastic "For Sale" sign materaial (or thin wood or sheet metal - whatever) then use an X-Acto knife (or appropriate tool) to cut it out.

Make one very carefully, and flip it over and use it that way to make the pair.

This is for wrong sized - but proportional - anything - plates, scrolls, etc.

With no proportional wheel - simply do the math.

[robertdo]

I am using the Strad plans to make a Conte Vitali viola. I am finally cutting the f-holes. The plan specifies 75mm from the middle of upper eye to middle of lower eye. However the drawing is not to scale on this fact, so one cannot use the drawing as a template. Is this a common mistake on the Strad drawings? How do people handle this? It is too late for this viola because I have already cut the eyes. But maybe for the next violin or viola, I can do something different.

Thanks

I can't say for that particular poster but in the Strad posters I have, the drawings on the back corresponding to the f-holes or even the scroll are not always on scale indeed (I don't remember if it's the case for all of them since I don't have them in front of my eyes right now). So I simply trace the f-holes outline from the front picture that seems to match the measurements and in fine I do it by eyes.

[violins88]

I have always used a proportional wheel (a cheap plastic slide rule/scale, used in graphic design - to quickly size photos and drawings in order to enlarge or reduce them to fit an appropriate size space) then Xerox the original ff hole drawing to the appropriate size, then spray mount the back of the xerox paper and mount it on to a piece of plastic "For Sale" sign materaial (or thin wood or sheet metal - whatever) then use an X-Acto knife (or appropriate tool) to cut it out.

Make one very carefully, and flip it over and use it that way to make the pair.

This is for wrong sized - but proportional - anything plates, scrolls, etc.

With no proportional wheel - simply do the math.

Thanks Craig.

Since I have already cut the eyes to the specified dimensions, it seems to me best to use the given drawings, place the upper eye of the template on the cut upper hole. Pencil half way down. Then move the template so its lower eye is over the already cut hole. Pencil in the lower half of the f-hole. How does that sound?

[Craig Tucker]

Thanks Craig.

Since I have already cut the eyes to the specified dimensions, it seems to me best to use the given drawings, place the upper eye of the template on the cut upper hole. Pencil half way down. Then move the template so its lower eye is over the already cut hole. Pencil in the lower half of the f-hole. How does that sound?

If I was going to do it that way, I believe I'd do it on paper first - I'd draw the holes as they exist now - on a piece of paper - then move and copy the template on the paper to join them - so that you would be able to see exactly what you're going to look like, first - and make the necessary adjustments on paper rather than on the plate, or during the cut.

In any case you're going to alter the original proportions somewhat. But I believe that it probably can be done where no one is any the wiser...

FYI - here's what I was talking about

[violins88]

I can't say for that particular poster but in the Strad posters I have, the drawings on the back corresponding to the f-holes or even the scroll are not always on scale indeed (I don't remember if it's the case for all of them since I don't have them in front of my eyes right now). So I simply trace the f-holes outline from the front picture that seems to match the measurements and in fine I do it by eyes.

Robertd,

Thanks

John

[violins88]

If I was going to do it that way, I believe I'd do it on paper first - I'd draw the holes as they exist now - on a piece of paper - then move and copy the template on the paper to join them - so that you would be able to see exactly what you're going to look like, first - and make the necessary adjustments on paper rather than on the plate, or during the cut.

In any case you're going to alter the original proportions somewhat. But I believe that it probably can be done where no one is any the wiser...

FYI - here's what I was talking about

Craig,

Thanks again.

[Bill Yacey]

Just out of curiosity, is the rest of the plan outline drawings 1:1, or are they proportionally smaller too? You may have unbeknownst made a scale size instrument!

[Geoff-UK]

The Guad 1785 Viola poster I've just used to make a mould is way off - and its not just a scale issue. The uppers and lowers are 2mm light - but the middle and length is accurate - comparing the outline drawing to the cited dims ( taken with calipers )

If the dimensions are given as marked with calipers - then check the drawing out and try to adjust things.

They need to be used as a rough guide - its all they are.

The original Guad is all over the place anyway - so it hardly matters.

Geoff

[colledge]

I am using the Strad plans to make a Conte Vitali viola. I am finally cutting the f-holes. The plan specifies 75mm from the middle of upper eye to middle of lower eye. However the drawing is not to scale on this fact, so one cannot use the drawing as a template. Is this a common mistake on the Strad drawings? How do people handle this? It is too late for this viola because I have already cut the eyes. But maybe for the next violin or viola, I can do something different.

Thanks

Take the drawing to a good copy machine and resize it until the measurement matches. That'll put you much closer. Then print it on a overhead transparency. Cut it out and you have a template.

[Michael_Molnar]

I too have had lots of problems working from STRAD posters. I scan in the photo and PhotoShop it to get the profile/shape I want. Then I check the result against the provided measurements. It's a lot of work, but I like the results.

[Addie]

I too have had lots of problems working from STRAD posters. I scan in the photo and PhotoShop it to get the profile/shape I want. Then I check the result against the provided measurements. It's a lot of work, but I like the results.

I used Illustrator. I scaled, then traced to make a clean template. With pixels, you're not always sure where the edge really is, but a clean line drawing you're sure. Still, check it visually to make sure it looks right.

Also, even if you just scan, you can print in increments that a Xerox machine can't.

[Michael_Molnar]

Illustrator is an excellent program. I have it and should use it.

[scordatura]

Clearly Strad would prefer Illustrator (vector) and del Gesu Photoshop (raster).

[violins88]

I finally got around to measuring the Strad Plan photograph. The scale of the photograph matches the table listing on the back for major dimensions --- width of bouts. But when I measure the f-holes from center of eyes I do not get the 75mm which is shown on the drawing. In fact, I get 70mm. I had suspected the actual 3-D measurement with calipers might be different from the 2-D drawing, but using the 75mm results in a big error.

Conclusion: The Conte Vitali Strad Magazine drawing has a mistake in the f-hole length. Instead of 75 mm, it should probably be more like 70 mm.

[colledge]

I finally got around to measuring the Strad Plan photograph. The scale of the photograph matches the table listing on the back for major dimensions --- width of bouts. But when I measure the f-holes from center of eyes I do not get the 75mm which is shown on the drawing. In fact, I get 70mm. I had suspected the actual 3-D measurement with calipers might be different from the 2-D drawing, but using the 75mm results in a big error.

Conclusion: The Conte Vitali Strad Magazine drawing has a mistake in the f-hole length. Instead of 75 mm, it should probably be more like 70 mm.

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[robertdo]

Isn't 70 mm very small for a viola? I would have thought violas' f-holes were larger than violins'ones.

[violins88]

Isn't 70 mm very small for a viola? I would have thought violas' f-holes were larger than violins'ones.

I just measured the photograph on the Strad plans. 72 mm from center of eye to center of eye.

Thanks