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Alfieri

Violin E string adjuster

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I never use the one in the right of the picture. This type of string tuner doesn't let you get the proper string afterlenght.

Personally I prefer the hill type (in the middle) with loop e-string. But next time I will try to do the "surgery" to a ball end string.

If the string is not wound around the ball twice, you can usually slip it off. I slip it over my chinrest key and pop it off.

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Any thoughts on why the hill type would be preferred for most good violins over the uni (the left most tuner in the original post)? Does the uni really have a less steep string angle?

The UNI hook sits up so high above the tailpiece that in order for the four strings to find static equilibrium the tailpiece is twisted further downward on the e-string side and upward on the g-string side. This is not the case with the standard Hill tuner.

Bruce

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Anyone tried these - cremona tools

Helps to click on the info link to see just how they work. It seems that you may have to thread the string through from below ?

Interesting and cheap enough to experiment with.

The Uni's I have seen have been very badly made. The titanium tuners from Dick are 14.90 euro trade plus taxes. They are beautifully made and nice on a viola.

Geoff

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Anyone tried these - cremona tools

It seems that you may have to thread the string through from below ?

That's what it looks like to me, too; you thread through the base below the tailpiece, and then the channel the string sits on (along with the base) rocks far enough back and forth to change string pitch. Interesting idea.

If violinists have a choice of loop or ball for top string, violists don't seem to. It's just ball, I think, for the A string. I remember trying to dig the ball out of a metal core A string to use on a Hill style tuner for a viola setup. I ended up inadvertently cutting through the loop and making the string worthless.

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I don't understand why someone doesn't make a Hill style tuner that will accept a ball in a 2 pronged clasp where the Hill now has the hook. It might mean that the clasp (what was the hook) would be separate from the base. The clasp, at the end of a blade (just like the Hill hook is at the end of a blade), would be inserted from above the tailpiece hole and then the blade end would be screwed into place at its pivot point on the base under the tailpiece.

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That's what it looks like to me, too; you thread through the base below the tailpiece, and then the channel the string sits on (along with the base) rocks far enough back and forth to change string pitch. Interesting idea.

If violinists have a choice of loop or ball for top string, violists don't seem to. It's just ball, I think, for the A string. I remember trying to dig the ball out of a metal core A string to use on a Hill style tuner for a viola setup. I ended up inadvertently cutting through the loop and making the string worthless.

Larsen do a loop option for viola in all gauges - not much else though. There is a make with a removable ball - but not sure which.

Geoff

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Nicholas has a good point...The string adjuster that gives you the correct string length between the bridge and the tailpiece (55mm or thereabouts) should be the correct choice for maximizing the string sound. The adjuster arm that comes up through the tailpiece mount does a pretty good job of that. I take a very fine file and file down the factory edges though so it doesn't damage the loop.

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I don't understand why someone doesn't make a Hill style tuner that will accept a ball in a 2 pronged clasp where the Hill now has the hook. It might mean that the clasp (what was the hook) would be separate from the base. The clasp, at the end of a blade (just like the Hill hook is at the end of a blade), would be inserted from above the tailpiece hole and then the blade end would be screwed into place at its pivot point on the base under the tailpiece.

The original Hill tuner had a small flat metal accessory that slipped over the hook of the tuner and at the other end had a curved bend with a hole drilled through it so that you could use a ball end string.

Personally, I have tried the same e-string with or without this small accessory and although it shortens the afterlength I was not able to perceive any acoustic change to the instrument, nor could the players who tried it.

Bruce

post-29446-1283079250.jpg

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[

+++quot

Wow, Stone age devices.

Buy a perfection peg and try it. It is only a few dollars investment.

I am sure you will appreciate it. It is called "perfecton peg" without a reason?

I have no financial interest in what I recommend but I hate to see people still live in dark age.

Here is the idea (you be the judge)

if you turn the peg 4 times and the shaft only turns 1 time. ( 4 to 1) how good or how bad is its service?

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[

+++quot

Wow, Stone age devices.

Buy a perfection peg and try it. It is only a few dollars investment.

I am sure you will appreciate it. It is called "perfecton peg" without a reason?

I have no financial interest in what I recommend but I hate to see people still live in dark age.

Here is the idea (you be the judge)

if you turn the peg 4 times and the shaft only turns 1 time. ( 4 to 1) how good or how bad is its service?

Fellow,

I am now convinced that you are a MAJOR SHAREHOLDER in the Perfection Planetary Peg and likely the president and chairman of the board of administration in disguise! :)

Bruce

P.S. Hey Jeff, is this a plug?

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Fellow,

I am now convinced that you are a MAJOR SHAREHOLDER in the Perfection Planetary Peg and likely the president and chairman of the board of administration in disguise! :)

Bruce

P.S. Hey Jeff, is this a plug?

+++++++++++++

I only have two sets of "perfection pegs" Only two sets. :)

cannot be the President of anything. I better spand time to watch...

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They make little (really little) plastic gizmos to go on the hook of single prong adjusters. I have used them, but I have had very little problem with e strings breaking at the loop anyway. The good news is that E strings are still pretty cheap, and you usually replace them before they break.

Dwight

http://www.sharmusic.com/Shop-Shar/Accesso...-Protectors.axd

I did have trouble with E strings breaking at the loop, and I bought the plastic protectors, but it was extremely difficult to get them in place and keep them there while putting the string on. I filed the prong to take the sharp edges off, and threw the plastic things away.

Bernie

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I did have trouble with E strings breaking at the loop, and I bought the plastic protectors, but it was extremely difficult to get them in place and keep them there while putting the string on. I filed the prong to take the sharp edges off, and threw the plastic things away.

Bernie

Yes, there's often a sharp burr that is formed on the edge of the hook when the pieces are punched out of a sheet. Often these have to be rounded where the string loop rests.

Bruce

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No one has invented the perfect tuner, shoulder pad, chin rest, or mouse trap. Get busy, guys! There's money to be made.

As a player I always simply looked for the lightest, most unobtrusive E tuner I could find. Tuners are not pretty and can't be improved by "gold." I never worried much about them because I found I'd wear them out pretty fast, whether they had a brand name or not. They never seemed to cost enough to worry about. I haven't checked prices lately. Maybe that's become a consideration.

I went through a period of having broken strings, but it wasn't the tuner, it was the brand of string. After monkeying with the tuner, the strings still broke. I switched brands. No more problem. Sadly, I don't remember which brand that was and they may have improved things by now anyway.

Hint: A little soap or peg dope helps tuners that are, or have become, a little rough.

Will L

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No one has invented the perfect tuner, shoulder pad, chin rest, or mouse trap. Get busy, guys! There's money to be made.

As a player I always simply looked for the lightest, most unobtrusive E tuner I could find. Tuners are not pretty and can't be improved by "gold." I never worried much about them because I found I'd wear them out pretty fast, whether they had a brand name or not. They never seemed to cost enough to worry about. I haven't checked prices lately. Maybe that's become a consideration.

I went through a period of having broken strings, but it wasn't the tuner, it was the brand of string. After monkeying with the tuner, the strings still broke. I switched brands. No more problem. Sadly, I don't remember which brand that was and they may have improved things by now anyway.

Hint: A little soap or peg dope helps tuners that are, or have become, a little rough.

Will L

=+++++++++++++++

One reason the strings breaking easily is that you have to tune it more often than necessary.

Good pegs (non-slippery) will help. I cut down frequency of string replacements by huge amount.

Thank the pegs. I would not mention the name. It is too sensitive now.

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I usualy opt for the Hill style tuner, most of my clients prefer them, for student instruments the Wittner tailpieces with the built in tuners get the nod, I smooth the hook of the Hill tuner and use the small plastic sleaves - a drop of super glue holds them in place but putting them on is a test of patience, more than one is lost on my shop floor.

regarding viola strings - does Evah Pir. make a loop end A string? I have a client who likes them and also wants a Hill style tuner.

The tuner pictured in the Cremona tool link works well, nice smooth action. the word of caution is that changing strings is a bit of a learning curve for players, the arm assembly is only held through the underside slot of the tailpeice by the string pressure of the ball threaded thru the arm, changing strings might involve having that come out - which makes treading the new string in easier but them the arm and string needs to be guided up thru the slot. taking the whole tailpeice off is easy in the shop, harder in the concert hall. the small collor on the screw is a press fit in the string hole from under the tailpeice, it has a small o ring to hold it in place but if the hole in the tailpeice is too large or small it will be problem, again the upward pressure of the string holds it in place. It is an interesting design and well made but not user friendly.

Reese

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I use the "Gotz" adjuster on both my violins...it claims to more effectively preserve the afterlength because the E connects with the ebony ridge on the tailpiece (technical term for this?)...the E also lays in a similar angle as the G,D,A after the bridge- I guess other tuners cause the E string to rise a bit higher? I didn't really notice, however, any tangible improvement in sound over a hill tuner... But they look nice, almost the same as a hill, and work well - and I guess the concept makes sense? Maybe it can make a difference with some violins...

http://www.gotzviolins.de/kinnhalter-chinrest/Adjusters-for-e-string-Violins/Fine-tuner-Adjuster-BLACK-with-gold-plated-screw-f-E-String::133.html

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