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Alfieri

Violin E string adjuster

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I like and use the sort in the middle. Others will weigh in I'm sure. If you keep it lubricated with something it works really well. I just use soft graphite from a pencil.

Dwight

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All three of the above tuners will work with an E string with an end loop, instead of the ball. Of course, you can turn an E string that has a ball at the end into a looped one by removing the ball. But with some brands of E strings, removing the ball takes some effort with needle nose pliers, and there's a chance of putting a crimp in the loop, which can result in the loop breaking easily.

Of the three tuners, I think (but am not sure) that the one on the extreme left has two prongs, and I'm certain the one on the extreme right has 2 prongs. In addition to accepting a loop, these two tuners will work well with ball end E strings. (If the one on the extreme left doesn't have two prongs, I know that there are tuners similar to it, or the middle one, that do have two prongs, but apparently they're not that easy to locate.)

The middle one with one prong will not work with a ball end E string, and you'll have to remove the ball if you get a ball end string.

I have reservations about the tuner on the extreme right. It is considerably heavier than the others. The lever that descends as you turn the screw clockwise can get pushed into the fiddle top, dinging it. And that tuner effectively shortens the afterlength of the string.

However, the one on the the extreme right I believe has the advantage of allowing a wider range of pitch adjustment than do the other two.

I like the two on the left because they are light, there is no possibility of any part of the tuner being pushed into the top, and the afterlength for the E string is about the same as for the other strings.

If those two tuners differ, as I think they do, in the leftmost having two prongs (to accept a ball end) and the middle one with a single prong (to accept only a loop), a preference for ball end or loop end E string would decide which tuner you want, if your choice is between the 2 left ones.

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I think the extreme left adjuster ( uni two prongs ) will be my choice, because I can use as much string loop end and ball end, but the height of the string is above the others and it seems strange.

post-29980-1281981263_thumb.png

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'''The middle one with one prong will not work with a ball end E string, and you'll have to remove the ball if you get a ball end string. ''

- you can loop the ball over the hook, although you can removed the ball on some types of string.

I use the one in the middle, black colour, with a large screw head.

If you unwind the screw so it's longer and adjust the peg acordingly, then it's easier to turn the screw.....

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'''The middle one with one prong will not work with a ball end E string, and you'll have to remove the ball if you get a ball end string. ''

- you can loop the ball over the hook, although you can removed the ball on some types of string.

If I understand correctly, with the ball left in place, there's still enough slack in the loop to fit the ball behind the hook. I've got to try that. I would like to leave the ball in place because the bare loop against the hook edges causes wear on the loop and results in broken E strings if you don't round down the hook edges. The ball, made from soft brass, doesn't cause as much wear on the loop as the steel hook will.

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They make little (really little) plastic gizmos to go on the hook of single prong adjusters. I have used them, but I have had very little problem with e strings breaking at the loop anyway. The good news is that E strings are still pretty cheap, and you usually replace them before they break.

Dwight

http://www.sharmusic.com/Shop-Shar/Accesso...-Protectors.axd

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I think the extreme left adjuster ( uni two prongs ) will be my choice, because I can use as much string loop end and ball end, but the height of the string is above the others and it seems strange.

post-29980-1281981263_thumb.png

I've got to get me some of those. They would be my preference. I'd like to keep the ball (or spool) in the loop, if possible.

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If I understand correctly, with the ball left in place, there's still enough slack in the loop to fit the ball behind the hook. I've got to try that. I would like to leave the ball in place because the bare loop against the hook edges causes wear on the loop and results in broken E strings if you don't round down the hook edges. The ball, made from soft brass, doesn't cause as much wear on the loop as the steel hook will.

I don't think that your approach will work. The balls with holes will fit over some of the Hill-type hooks (hook through the hole) and the others can be slimmed down with a Dremel tool. I've done that successfully. The balls that don't have holes, of course, require some precise drill work.

As noted above, the uni type sits above the tailpiece and changes the e-string angle. If you use four fine tuners, though, that is not a problem. I like them, but they are more expensive than some and not as easy to find.

Lyle

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I don't think that your approach will work. The balls with holes will fit over some of the Hill-type hooks (hook through the hole) and the others can be slimmed down with a Dremel tool. I've done that successfully. The balls that don't have holes, of course, require some precise drill work.

As noted above, the uni type sits above the tailpiece and changes the e-string angle. If you use four fine tuners, though, that is not a problem. I like them, but they are more expensive than some and not as easy to find.

Lyle

Lyle,

Thanks for that clarification. I had my doubts that there was enough slack in the loop to fit over the hook with the ball left in place. I also have my doubts that the hole on the ball (or spool) of the strings I use would fit over the tuner hook, unless the hole were enlarged -- something of a hassle.

So, I'm back to either removing the ball (spool) or putting on a uni type tuner that accepts the ball.

I hadn't thought about the change in string angle the uni type tuner would bring, namely a less steep angle. I wonder if the uni type and the Hill type do really result in different string angles, with the uni type being less steep than the single prong Hill type.

Looking at my fiddles, the single prong Hill type does retain something close to the same angle on the E string that the other tuner-less strings have -- maybe somewhat less steep than the other tuner-less strings. If the single prong Hill type does a better job of retaining the proper string angle on the E string than the uni type does, then maybe that's reason enough to keep the single prong Hill type on my E string. It's there now on all my violins, and has had its sharp edges rubbed down so that string breakage isn't a problem.

I'm guessing that the single prong Hill type that accepts the loop is more popular than the uni type that accepts the ball. I know I've had trouble locating the uni type. Could there be a tonal difference because of the different string angles they produce, if indeed they do produce different string angles?

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Here Skiing, hill type tuner and ball end e string. Not very elegant, but it's secure and it works. It's a common thing around here, nobody stocks too many loop end strings but most good violins have the hill single prong.

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Here Skiing, hill type tuner and ball end e string. Not very elegant, but it's secure and it works. It's a common thing around here, nobody stocks too many loop end strings but most good violins have the hill single prong.

Thanks, Darren. Did you have to enlarge the ball hole or file the prong slimmer to make that all work?

I wonder what the reason is for most good violins having the hill single prong instead of the uni (the left most tuner in the original post)?

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No modification needed for the hole or the ball. It all works, it's just not particularily pretty.

Any thoughts on why the hill type would be preferred for most good violins over the uni (the left most tuner in the original post)? Does the uni really have a less steep string angle?

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Any thoughts on why the hill type would be preferred for most good violins over the uni (the left most tuner in the original post)? Does the uni really have a less steep string angle?

Honestly I couldn't say about either question. I'd just be guessing

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Can someone plesae help me to choose the right string adjuster, only for E string ??

What type is the best ??

post-29980-1281927668_thumb.png

+++++++++++++++++

Exactly? None of the above.

I would use one perfection peg (about $12-$20 for one peg. $70 for a set of 4)

Why? It looks exactly as an ordinary peg and it has no weight problem on the tailpiece.

Perfection pegs are pegs Which have gears inside the pegs. Your e-tring adjuster is also a geared

device. Only difference is that the gear of your device shows. Do you know what I am talking about?

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I think the extreme left adjuster ( uni two prongs ) will be my choice, because I can use as much string loop end and ball end, but the height of the string is above the others and it seems strange.

post-29980-1281981263_thumb.png

Alfieri,

Comparing the image of the E string angle in your post with the E string angle in the images of the Hill style tuner that Darren Molnar posted, I'd say that the uni two prong does, as Lyle was suggesting, attach to the E string so that the end of the string is higher off the tailpiece than it would be with the Hill style. Just judging from those images, it looks like the Hill style would give you an E string angle to the bridge that would be more like the angle you have on the other three strings, while the uni two prong would, as you have noted, give a different, less steep angle to the bridge. Those differences in string angle (if they really exist and are not an artifact of the way the photos were taken) may very well be the reason there might be a preference for the Hill style tuner, because string angle can influence tone.

I've bought 2 violins directly from professional makers, and both of those came with the Hill style E string tuner. I've also gotten a professional quality violin from a dealer and that also came with a Hill style tuner. Now that I think of it, all the professional quality violins I can remember playing had Hill style tuners for the E string. Very tentatively I'd say that the the consensus for professionally set up instruments is the use of a Hill style tuner for the E string.

I've ordered one of the uni style, and will give it a try. But from what I've seen and read on this thread, there may be a very clear reason to prefer a Hill style tuner, namely, the string angle for the E string is more like the string angle the other three, tuner-less strings have.

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Can someone plesae help me to choose the right string adjuster, only for E string ??

What type is the best ??

post-29980-1281927668_thumb.png

I never use the one in the right of the picture. This type of string tuner doesn't let you get the proper string afterlenght.

Personally I prefer the hill type (in the middle) with loop e-string. But next time I will try to do the "surgery" to a ball end string.

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