Homemade cases?

[polkat]

I noticed that too, and also how there is no support to keep the violin from sliding around inside (assuming it is not such a small case that the violin fits fairly tight inside to begin with). Welshman's case is nice!

So are you folks carving white styrofoam to fit the fiddle, gluing it in and then covering that with velvet (or whatever it is)?

[welshman]

Hi Glen,

Wow, you are taxing my memory as how did I make the case. I've had to repair the spring loaded holders on a few cases after the screw internal came undone. I may have to redesign mine to incorperate some kind of a lock system. I put them in reverse so as to keep the frogs away from the main body of the violin, the 45 corners look nice but it did limit bow space. I also sewed up a brown linen cover for it to protect the outside but would use a commercial bag now.

My first impulse was that the Strad. case was just for the violin, do you have any measurments on length, the proportions looked odd in the Hill illustration?

Perhaps you would like to see photos of a portable drafting case (drawing board and space for tools and supplies) I designed way back in 1984. Its had some were and tear to it but it still functions well.

Reese

[welshman]

So are you folks carving white styrofoam to fit the fiddle, gluing it in and then covering that with velvet (or whatever it is)?

I used a dense foam but not stiff like styrofoam, it is white but not as dense as a closed cell type, I got it at a fabric store, pillow foam? or something used for chair pads or matresses? Don't really remember, as students we haunted junk stores and resale shops looking for all sorts of stuff to use, I found a nice baroque style maple guitar in one that fixed up really nice, alas it went at for a song to a girl I was courting, it matched her voice so well and went with her red hair too.

Once the outline was cut with sizzors or knife the fabic is folded around the top and tucked under, srap contact glue on the top surface and to hold it on the bottom.

The alterative method is to use a separete top layer of fabric covering a template of cardboard or veneer cut for the case section and outline of the violin, fabric glued and folded under the edge, it would go on top of the foam layer with just the sides and bottom covered. The affect is a hard top surface, I think that some of the cases Glenn pictured have this method, I has a name but all I can remember is a "French Style" but I may be mistaken.

The foam insert is made separate and then glued into the case, the bottom layer can be made separate too.

Reese

[richardz]

There is an alternate way of making foam inserts. I'm not sure if it's been mentioned already, and I'm also not sure what it's called but it consists of liquid foam in a pressurized can (sort of like shaving cream) that hardens after contact with the air. You could either fill a case bottom with it and carve it out (it's stiffer than foam rubber) or you could also surround a violin with plastic and then immerse it in the unhardened foam to create a molded violin shaped impression when the material hardens. This is probably a more industrial method and lends itself more to mass production but it does have certain positive attributes that might lend themselves to custom cases. As I said, I'm not sure what the specific product name is but I've bought what must be a similar product at the hardware store. It was foam in a can used for weatherproofing. You can use it to fill large strange shaped gaps in walls etc. to seal out the wind and cold and it does harden so you can carve it. This might even be appropriate for violin cases if so is easilly accessible in hardware stores. Off-gassing is a consideration with these type of products so I would make sure to find out if the gas produced by the curing foam is 1) toxic or 2) harmful to the violin finish over the long term.

[Sharron]

There is an alternate way of making foam inserts. I'm not sure if it's been mentioned already, and I'm also not sure what it's called but it consists of liquid foam in a pressurized can (sort of like shaving cream) that hardens after contact with the air. You could either fill a case bottom with it and carve it out (it's stiffer than foam rubber) or you could also surround a violin with plastic and then immerse it in the unhardened foam to create a molded violin shaped impression when the material hardens. This is probably a more industrial method and lends itself more to mass production but it does have certain positive attributes that might lend themselves to custom cases. As I said, I'm not sure what the specific product name is but I've bought what must be a similar product at the hardware store. It was foam in a can used for weatherproofing. You can use it to fill large strange shaped gaps in walls etc. to seal out the wind and cold and it does harden so you can carve it. This might even be appropriate for violin cases if so is easilly accessible in hardware stores. Off-gassing is a consideration with these type of products so I would make sure to find out if the gas produced by the curing foam is a) toxic or harmful to the violin finish over the long term.

I have also used this and found a little press on the top gives a LOT of foam.

It does stink a bit, but I would have thought that after curing and carving and then covering it should be ok.

It tends to dry hard.

Excellent idea though and inexpensive and easily sourced.

Sharron

[M A T T]

Neat topic, I though about making my own case once.

Here are pics of another old case, my 1885 Hill case. I have the key for it too:

[GlennYorkPA]

I noticed that too, and also how there is no support to keep the violin from sliding around inside (assuming it is not such a small case that the violin fits fairly tight inside to begin with). Welshman's case is nice!

So are you folks carving white styrofoam to fit the fiddle, gluing it in and then covering that with velvet (or whatever it is)?

Polkat,

That Strad case is very small and barely accepts a full size violin. It goes without saying that it is too small for a bow so it would seem to be a shipper or storage trunk for a single instrument and nothing else. Few people have use for such a box these days.

I'm interested to here more of these foamy ideas. Do people really feel comfortable have a violin varnish in close proximity to these modern synthetics?

They are probably OK but I question if they have yet proved themselves to stand the test of time.

The traditional fitted interiors are made from cardboard, cloth and glue. Nothing more.

The Hill case shop at Hanwell didn't own a sewing machine.

It is surprising how robust a structure can be made by creating a kind of internal scaffolding with cardboard.

Glenn

[welshman]

Glenn,

I too would be reluctant to try the expandable foam, they do dry too hard and the curing involves heat (exothermal) and chemical byproducts fine for a house but maybe too much for a varnish. There is enough space and fabric between my foam supports and the violin so I'm comfortable with it, the foam is not too differrent than that used by modern case makers

I've had a few of the wood Hill cases in my shop, always neat to see but not so good on interior protection.

I've seen a violin case that opened at the bottom and you slide the violin out like a gun case, its been too long to remember detail.

Reese

[polkat]

I have an old tenor banjo case that is like that. It's a solid (sort of) fiberboard box with a door at the bottom that the banjo slides out of. It doesn't really offer much protection for the instrument though, but is interesting in being unusual.

I have been considering using the foam as well. It seems to me that once fully cured and covered with whatever interior material one chooses, the violin finish should be fairly well protected....OR....do these foam synthetics leach off chemicals long after they have cured??

[richardz]

I have an original violin case concept that is 60% completed that I would like to show pictures of here. The problem is I would maybe be giving away my idea/invention. What should I do in this case? (no pun intended)

[GlennYorkPA]

I have an old tenor banjo case that is like that. It's a solid (sort of) fiberboard box with a door at the bottom that the banjo slides out of. It doesn't really offer much protection for the instrument though, but is interesting in being unusual.

I have been considering using the foam as well. It seems to me that once fully cured and covered with whatever interior material one chooses, the violin finish should be fairly well protected....OR....do these foam synthetics leach off chemicals long after they have cured??

There is no rule requiring cases to open in the way we now take for granted.

The so-called 'holster' cases which opened at one end were made even into the 20th century. I also have a case in my collection which opens at the top edge and the violin slides in sideways.

It's interesting to think about why these styles didn't catch on.

Richardz - I wonder how revolutionary your idea really is. There are new materials around but most of the permutations of lids, locks, latches and linings have been tried before. If you are nervous about posting pictures, can you give a hint about wherein the originality lies?

Glenn

[zefir68]

One of the coolest cases and great in all areas, although heavy (9lbs+) is a case one of my students brought in. It is (was) his great grandfather's. The violin is very intriguing, another story. The case looks like a Jaeger shaped case but has a covering made out of silk that has a zipper down the middle that is built in to cover the violin. So you put the violin in, zipper the cover and you're done. The bow holders I also like, you snap the screw in rather than the twist knob in new cases that either hold the hair up or the stick. I miss the Jaeger cases. They are heavy, but protect the instrument so well. The Musafia cases that I have seen look great but are flimsy in comparison. If I were able to make a case, I would just build a replica of the Jaeger ones, use titanium, charge a super price for the lightness and make a mint.

[STRAD~STYLE]

Good idea to make your own i will whenever i get the time put my upholstery skills to use and redo cases inside and out ~in custom material

[welshman]

Hi ,

one more thought on the foam possiblities, go to a largecamera store and ask about the foam inserts they have for the aluminum camera cases the professional use, the foam is designed to the easily shaped for varius equipment by plucking the sections out. Could be a real shortcut for the basic interior pads.

Reese

[richardz]

Glenn:

I don't want to say too much, but it has nothing to do with materials, fittings etc...it's more along the lines of a concept about functionality. I takes an aspect of functionality that exists already and presents it in a novel way. That's the best way I can think of to describe it without giving it away.

[Tim McTigue]

Richardz: If you think your idea may be patentable, then do not divulge it at all in public. I don't know much about patent law, but what I have heard is that any public disclosure at all invalidates any chance at a patent, which is difficult and expensive to pursue. If you think your idea is commercial, you should probably see legal advice. At the very least, visit a government website devoted to intellectual property rights.

[richardz]

Tim: Thanks. I'll investigate the subject further. Your suggestion is a good start.

[captainhook]

Here's a little different arrangement that allows for a larger pocket(s) in the same footprint. The lining is fake fur. The other shot is the business end of my bow holder. It is very secure and prevents longitudinal movement.

Lyle

[GlennYorkPA]

Tim: Thanks. I'll investigate the subject further. Your suggestion is a good start.

Tim's advice is good. You can't patent something after it has been publicly disclosed but it's a nightmare writing and filing a patent with worldwide coverage not to mention the expense. There might be simpler options like a design registration but it didn't sound as though you were talking about a design issue.

Either way, enquiring minds wonder what you plan to do with this intellectual property.

There are almost as many penniless inventors as there are inventors. It's tricky to make money out of a good idea. The two options are:

1. Commercialize the idea yourself

2. Convince someone else to commercialize it in which case you would either charge an up front fee or take a royalty on each item sold or a combination of both.

Which route were you thinking of taking?

Glenn

[GlennYorkPA]

Here's a little different arrangement that allows for a larger pocket(s) in the same footprint. The lining is fake fur. The other shot is the business end of my bow holder. It is very secure and prevents longitudinal movement.

Lyle

Captain,

That is an unusual compartment design. You don't see that too often.

Polkat, are you capturing all these ideas?

Speaking of compartments, Luis Negri in Argentina, strongly believes in pushing the violin up to the left hand end of the case and placing the compartment at the right hand side. The logic being that damage is often caused when the frog drops onto the violin. With his arrangement, it drops safely onto the compartment lid.

(I like your bow holder. Simple but effective and puts no stress on the hair).

[Chris Knowlton]

I agree with all that Glen says.

I’ve had a lot of experience with patents throughout my career. A design patent might be the way to go. Essentially a design patent would protect the shape and look of your case, which might be all you need. A design patent is typically less expensive than a utility patent which protects a method or process.

As Glen mentioned you can try to sell your idea to a case manufacturer without getting a patent. Your idea can be protected by first having the case company sign a standard confidentiality agreement. Either way, get professional advice.

Chris

[GlennYorkPA]

One of the coolest cases and great in all areas, although heavy (9lbs+) is a case one of my students brought in. It is (was) his great grandfather's. The violin is very intriguing, another story. The case looks like a Jaeger shaped case but has a covering made out of silk that has a zipper down the middle that is built in to cover the violin. So you put the violin in, zipper the cover and you're done. The bow holders I also like, you snap the screw in rather than the twist knob in new cases that either hold the hair up or the stick. I miss the Jaeger cases. They are heavy, but protect the instrument so well. The Musafia cases that I have seen look great but are flimsy in comparison. If I were able to make a case, I would just build a replica of the Jaeger ones, use titanium, charge a super price for the lightness and make a mint.

I don't think those zippered blankets are such a good idea. It's not so easy to coax the violin in and out of those things and the teeth can easily scratch the varnish. You have to live with it for a while to see what a nuisance it can be.

On the other hand, a titanium Jaeger case sounds a novelty but I doubt you would make a mint from it. The market for high end cases seems quite limited.

Glenn

[Fellow]

I am thinking about making my own custom violin case. I've done a lot of violin work, but never approached this before. Can anyone show me, or guide me to examples? Thanks!

===================

How would you like a case like this (see photo) ?

It is made out of paper material, light weighted , and it preserves the shape of the violin.

Too bad, they don't make this kind of cases any more. It looks good because of its shape (vis-a-vis dart shape or rectangular ) and it is easy to carry

becasue its weight, inexpensive. It makes a lot of sense to me.

[richardz]

Glenn: Thank you for interest and for introducing the term "design registration". That's something I'll look into. Sounds like you need less lawyering that way. ha ha I think it might fit into that category.

As far as my plan? I have no grand plan. At this point it is an idea I came up with and produced most of the parts in a friends shop till he lost his shop, and now it has been sitting in pieces for a year or so in my apt. I've been busy with other things. Seeing the interest in cases here made me think about it again. At the time my plan was to build one, cover myself legally if possible as far as the concept goes, then start using it and see what type of response I got. I live in NYC so I could bring it around certain places to see if it was interesting to different types of people. (Test Marketing) I would then see about producing more if there was interest...probably on an individual basis. If there was enough interest generated I would seek larger production. With the internet and globalization the possibilities for small business and production has grown remarkably, but the downside is the current economy which doesn't seem like a good environment to invest too much in an unknown idea for something that isn't a necessity. Also, it's the type of thing that would appeal to some violinists, but not all. It wouldn't be in every violinists home. Maybe a specialty item as opposed to mass market. Sorry to be so vague.

Chris: Thank you for your clarification. From what you said, I'm quite sure it's more about design than method or process. I really appreciate you sharing your experience.

[polkat]

Yea Glenn, I'm just sort of sitting back and watching all the ideas go by, noting what I like here and there. I rather like Captainhook's idea of the violin going into the case on an angle. Makes for a very nice size accessory section.

One thing I have not seen in 'some' of the ideas is any serious method (straps?) of holding the violin stationary. Even in many of the commercial formed cases I've seen in stores, the violin can move around quite a bit inside the case, banging the ribs or tailpin against hard areas, or allowing the weight of the instrument to rest at least partially against the bridge while being carried. Many cases out there do approach this problem, but too many don't. As much of an art piece as some cases may be, there intention is to protect the instrument, which will be first priority in whatever I decide on.

Great responses here! Far more then I expected!