F Hole Knife (for Dean)

[Melvin Goldsmith]

In a recent thread Dean Lapinel asked what my F hole cutting knife

looks like. Here is a pic of what works for me. I'd be

interested to see some others.

[Darren Molnar]

Here's the three I used for double bass f- holes.

The one with the rosewood handle was made by a local knife maker,

the gold folding one is a japanese utility knife from lee valley,

and the one just in the top of the picture is the trusty x-acto

style.

For violins, I'm embarrassed to admit I use the x-acto with

the #11 blade mostly.

[M_A_T_T]

I've been using a hobby knife with #11 blade.

[David Burgess]

Melvin, I wish I was good enough to use pencils without erasers!

[Magnus Nedregard]

I use these mostly, the single-bevel knife for the narrow parts and some convex curves and the other one for all the rest. And I use a circular cutter for the holes. My f-holes might look like this;

Melvin, that's a pretty particular knife, is it sharpened on both sider or is it just rounded?

[David Tseng]

Melvin, I can't see the tip too well. It looks like the tip has 3 cutting edges.

[Joseph Sellers]

Melvin,

Did you make that knife? If so is it specifically for F-holes?

Keep well,

J

[Melvin Goldsmith]

My knife is double bevel. I made it myself very hastily but it

seems to do the job in a way that feels right for me.

I mainly use this knife for F holes but it does get some work

 during purfling....mainly in the corners.

[Melvin Goldsmith]

Magnus,

Nice looking F & varnish/texture.

[Melvin Goldsmith]

quote:

---

Originally posted by: David Burgess Melvin, I wish

I was good enough to use pencils without erasers!

[TimRobinson]

Recently I had the great opportunity to watch, and photograph a new violin being made for my youngest. I learnt an enourmous amount. Here are some shots of the fhole knife and the end product. I have others, but they show the maker and I haven't asked consent to post them on the web yet.

The knife was made by the maker from a piece of high speed steel. It is flat on one side, that is only bevelled on one edge.

Regards,

Tim

[Magnus Nedregard]

But do you folks use a saw, or do you cut directly with the knife? And has someone ever tried drawing the f only on the inside? It must be a thrill to cut the f's that way, never tried, wouldn't really have the confidence! And is the Sacconi method (drilling holes, template only connecting holes, and placed on the inside, no saw) still widely seen as the method for the whole cremonese school, or has any criticism of that come up?

[TimRobinson]

[Melvin Goldsmith]

quote:

---

Originally posted by:

magnus nedregard

But do you

folks use a saw, or do you cut directly with the knife? And has

someone ever tried drawing the f only on the inside? It must be a

thrill to cut the f's that way, never tried, wouldn't really have

the confidence!

And is the Sacconi method (drilling holes, templateonly connecting holes, and placed on the inside, no saw) stillwidely seen as the method for the whole cremonese school, or hasany criticism of that come up?

---

.....................................................Hi MagnusI go in with a knife every time on violin to cello...maybe notbass.I rough out, glue the corners to stop them chipping andfinalize....I'd choose a knife to rough out every time and this

very thin sharp laminated Japanese blade used by

parasole makers works best

[Darren Molnar]

On the bass I cut out with a saw first. On the others, I'll just

use a knife for rough outs. I've never been brave enough to work

from the inside of the plate. That would be quite a rush, though.

[captainhook]

quote:

---

Originally posted by:

magnus nedregard

But do you folks use a saw, or do you cut directly with the knife? And has someone ever tried drawing the f only on the inside? It must be a thrill to cut the f's that way, never tried, wouldn't really have the confidence!

And is the Sacconi method (drilling holes, template only connecting holes, and placed on the inside, no saw) still widely seen as the method for the whole cremonese school, or has any criticism of that come up?

---

I seldom use a saw. When I do it is to make a single cut to make starting the knife a little easier. But mostly it isn't worth the trouble of using the saw. I cut one set of f's from the inside. It worked fine but seemed a little awkward since I'm not used to it.

I use two knives, for this and many other things. The upper one is a #11 scalpel blade in a wooden handle, the lower one a double edge single bevel made from a hacksaw blade.

[Dean_Lapinel]

First off it's apparent that skill trumps the tool.

In other words many of you fine craftman could use the small blade of a pocket knife to get your results.

However...if you wanted to cut an F hole in style then the best looking functional tool would be a hand forged thin single bevel quenched so the small spine was softer (covered in clay). Tempered so the edge could cut through the hard reed at the tip but not break because of the spine.

Since the tip is should be so narrow to take the turn near the upper eye well, it's hard to protect the spine so another approach is to forge weld a softer steel to back the tool steel edge.

Since it's a single bevel then you need two.

The angle of the swiss blades is not optimal and those blades tend to be brittle. These can be annealed, reground, hardened and tempered to your satifaction. The Melvin Japanese blade looks really nice and two of them would probably do well.

Personally, since I enjoy fine looking tools, I will be forging a few different designs and spend the time to put the blades in fine looking handles. I like the ugly but functional blade (I've posted pics before) on one of my knives that I'll probably replicate.

Melvin- Your little knife obviously works well for you due to the size and the likely fact that you sharpen it often. If it was harder and held it's edge well I would think it would break easily. I switched from a double bevel flat back marking knife to a single bevel due to tip chip.