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GMM22

Bad Strad?

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Back to the main topic, the late Al Stancel once intimated here

that there were a few lame or lemon Cremonese.

Someone showed me an Andrea Guarneri

with stunning varnish

that had the tinniest little pipsqueek of a tone

and the shop owner said much the same.

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I wonder how much that Andrea Guarneri has been through since

leaving the hands of it's maker?

If I gave to a few 'would-be' 'tone improving guru's' a modern

violin, and said, " Go to town lads, have a blast! ",  I

wonder how it would sound a a few weeks time. Please note ladies

that I excluded you on purpose.

Perhaps we should conduct a "Scientific Study" here and do this as

an experiment?

First we will need someone to volunteer a 'great' sounding violin

....Hint hint!   David that's your cue to step up and

volunteer!

Next, then we will need some 'hacks',  Oh Gee where will I

find those???????  This could be hard.  Let me see now.

This might be harder than I had originally thought.  It looks

like finding a few 'would-be' 'tone improving guru's'  is

going to be next to impossible to find.  

Maybe David we'll have to put this experiment on hold until we can

find someone who can make a proper job of messing-up a perfectly

good sounding violin. Sorry for getting your's and everybody

else's hopes up. My most sincere apologies, I promise it won't

happen again. Really

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Since I am having a hard time finding a few 'would-be' 'tone

improving guru's' , do you think that if we added a case of

to the mix we could approximate a few 'would-be' 'tone improving

guru's', or would this compromise the outcome too

much?????

Perhaps if we tried something harder, say.  What's that?

No!

Oh well back to the drawing board ... I sure hope I can go from

failure to failure here without any loss of

enthusiasm.

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I recall hearing many years ago that there was one Strad that was so weak from worm damage that it could no longer be played. It was known as the "wormy" Strad. I have no idea how it might have sounded before the worms did it in.

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quote:


Originally posted by:
Janito
I think he had time

to jig and scatch!! How else would he have lured a young

bride.

All I can say for sure is that if he had 11 kids and 1200 plus

instruments, then he had to be a fast worker.

Perhaps Stradivari did not suffer from the find that Sir Walter

Raleigh brought back from the new world.... on both counts!

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quote:


Originally posted by:
NewNewbie

Perhaps we should conduct a "Scientific Study" here and do this as

an experiment?


It's easy enough to mess up a decent sounding violin. I've done it deliberately a few times with reasonable sounding Strads, handed them to an average player, told them what they were playing, and watched them still go into orga......uh, I mean rapture over the magniforous tone!

Off the top of my head, I can think of a couple of Strads, average or better shape and originality, that don't sound too good. (Bad, maybe?)

No, I'm not namin' names.

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I was flicking through some old Strad magazines, when I can upon an article by Robert Lewin on Vuillaume (Nov 1983, p485).

There in all their B&W glory were photos of the "Messiah", front and back.

I did a double take. What...a heavily worn patch of varnish caused by a chin.

That was all the evidence I needed to prove that this was really Tony's favourite instrument...

Then I paused, like all competent hacks, to check my sources.

Wouzzer...the violin at the Ashmolean is a fake without the worn patch. QED.

Who needs dendrochronology?

-------------------------

NewNewbie

The potato was credited with being the cause of the pox. Interestingly, tobacco smoke enemas were advocated as cures. Coincidence or what???

I should know - I live in Raleigh.

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quote:


Originally posted by:
David Burgess

It's easy enough to mess up a decent sounding violin. I've done it deliberately a few times with reasonable sounding Strads, handed them to an average player, told them what they were playing, and watched them still go into orga......uh, I mean rapture over the magniforous tone!

DICTIONARY.COM:

No results found for 'magniforous'.

Did you mean magnetiferous (in dictionary)

or Carnivorous (in encyclopedia)?

You evil thing - that might have been me!

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quote:


Originally posted by:
Omobono

DICTIONARY.COM:

No results found for 'magniforous'.

Did you mean magnetiferous (in dictionary)

or Carnivorous (in encyclopedia)?


I occasionally give myself permission to make up new words.

I wonder though if I should have spelled it "magniferous"?

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quote:


Originally posted by:
Darren Molnar
Does the

Messiah get played at all any more?

I would have to guess that the Messie/Salabue Stradivarius was a

'Bad Strad' and so is suffering a 'Time-Out'.

"http://odeo.com/show/3874513/view">http://odeo.com/show/3874513/view

I know of some people that have played the Messie/Salabue in

private, but the goal is to maintain the pristine condition of the

instrument, so a rigorous concert schedule will only happen if some

enemy of England wins a war against her, and decides to flaunt

their victory.

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quote:


Originally posted by:
NewNewbie
quote:


Originally

posted by:
Darren Molnar
Does the Messiah get played at

all any more?

I would have to guess that the

Messie/Salabue Stradivarius was a 'Bad Strad' and so is suffering a

'Time-Out'.
"http://odeo.com/show/3874513/view">

I know of some people that have played the Messie/Salabue in

private, but the goal is to maintain the pristine condition of the

instrument, so a rigorous concert schedule will only happen if some

enemy of England wins a war against her, and decides to flaunt

their victory.

................................................................................

........................................................

I'm no fan of theories on The Messie sound........

On the other hand I did witness the Cannon del Gesu in Vengerov's

hands a few years ago at a special concert at London's Royal

Academy...........I bought cheap seats at the back with a

purpose....All I could hear was the piano and there was no

encore.....If this concert had beeen with the Messie  I can

only imagine the response!....

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I don't think I am qualified to reply to this subject at all.

 But I recall in my casual reading, coming across some

information (forgot the source) like that  there are only ~200

Strads and ~70 del Gesus in concert-condition, worthy of being used

by a soloist.  If that is correct then only 1 out every 3

Strads and del Gesus are preserved well enough to serve top

musicians, while 2 out of 3 are just precious historical relics.

 Even if this is true I am sure every owner would strongly

argue that his Strad  belongs to the better third.  I

also read casually that when some Strads are scanned by

computer tomography,, the dealers' and owners' jaws fell off at the

horrifying sight of hidden worm holes, repaired cracks and

other signs of a troubled past.  But then again all I have

said is hearsay and I have no clue about the actual situation

 

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quote:


Originally posted by:
Wm. Johnston

The Spanish and Rode inlaid Strads are featured on the Glory of Cremona CD along with many non-inlaid Strads and Guarneris.

Oscar Schumsky (who presumably owned or played the instrument)

has recorded the Rode Etudes on the Strad of that name

and it sounded fine to me.

(Is there only one Rode Strad?)

rode1.jpg<B">http://www.bayermusicgroup.de/...s/ebs6007.htm">Rode

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A few years ago I was lucky enough to play the Rode strad also, along with a few others. It was a very pure sounding violin, perhaps not the biggest tone but we all (myself, Gil Shaham and dealer friends) felt it would be great for a violin sonata/ solo recording !!

As for 'Bad strads' ...they all started out in life as masterpieces....over time some have had damage and more so you are left with a Strad plus the quality of repairer...........

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"As for 'Bad strads' ...they all started out in life as masterpieces"

I object, honoriferous judge!

This is conjecturification.

BTW neologism is associated with which of the following?

A Politicians

B Violin makers that cook their varnish indoors

C Gangstas

D Schizophrenia

E Someone creative that likes to have fun

F All of the above

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Aside from the question of whether or not all Strads started out as masterpieces, this comment does seem quite significant....

"....over time some have had damage and more so you are left with a Strad plus the quality of repairer........... "

jimbow

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All words were new at one point or another. As long as a word has sufficient roots in either other words, or common use, there is no real problem. One of the reasons English has more words than any other language is that we steal words with wild abandon. The other is that we make them up almost as freely.

The result is a bit of a mess, but still quite usable...definitely a wide range of choices.

"Magniferous, splendiferous"--all quite workable. What is sad is to listen to professional journalists butcher words and grammar.

Mr. Burgess, carry on! You can make up words anytime you want. :-) You and Lewis Carroll...

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quote:


Originally posted by:
Bishopstrings

As for 'Bad strads' ...they all started out in life as masterpieces....

Your evidentiography for for this assertation?

("evidentiography": Evidence presented in a graphic or written manner, or alternately, of a bibliographic nature.)

quote:


Originally posted by:
Dean_Lapinel

BTW neologism is associated with which of the following?

A Politicians

B Violin makers that cook their varnish indoors

C Gangstas

D Schizophrenia

E Someone creative that likes to have fun

F All of the above

G: Neolanderthals?

("neolanderthals": those who use neologisms quite by accident and without realizing it, due to their primitive, less-evolved status)

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I agree that all Strads probably started out at least a cut above average, but usage, handling and ENVIRONMENT play big parts in their present sound and

playability. The "Lipinski" is a great example. It was one of the big dog Strads

for most of its life but then it was bought by a Cuban player Angel something

or other and spent years in that tropical environment plus some less than optimal

maintenance and now its not soloist quality and probably will never be again.

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