strange labels with "paper towel" texture . . ??

[Tyler]

As they say, "A fool is born every minute..." so obviously there is no shortage of willing partners ready to play the role of the fool.

[Richf]

Now that I know what to look for, I see the pixels indicating a copied labels all the time. Here's another one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...item=7328125796

I have often wondered about this NY seller, richietman, but this is pretty compelling evidence. He even used a color copier.

[Regis]

That is mis-leading or mis-representing the item but, $565 is not out of line if it is "all there and glued" and worth even more if it plays well. It's not quite like the sellers pushing fake violins for many thousands of $$'s. I don't agree with fake lables at all but, I do understand getting $500 violin for $500. Using fake lables (even if declared) is still bad partly because the buyer may try to sell as "authenic" for $K's to the next person and, actually get it.

The $500 violin for $500 sellers with fake lable should be banned. But the $500 violin for $30,000 sellers with fake everything should be jailed.

[Brad Dorsey]

Oddly enough, although the label in this violin is obviously photocopied, I believe it is original to this violin and not inserted by the Ebay seller. I have seen many "Juzek" violins with exactly this type of photocopied label. The only thing on this label that is not black or white is a drop of varnish.

[priya]

What you say might be true, but that Ebay seller is from New York, and you know what that means....

[jackc]

I see my opportunity to make amends for my NY bashing of a few weeks ago...Richietman is not one of the NY Scammers. He seems to me to be an honest seller, who takes very dreamy pics of his offerings. That looks like a Juzek violin to me. In fact, many of the most upstanding ebay sellers are from the Big Apple area.

OK, did I lay it on thick enough?

[Richf]

I was prepared to believe that this instrument was indeed a Juzek until I saw that label. Brad says "I have seen many 'Juzek' violins with exactly this type of photocopied label." How can that be? Xerox wasn't around when these fiddles were made. I have heard of the moire effect in scanning pictures, but in this case why would the effect only show up on the paper label and not the rest of the photo? Apologies to Richietman if he is not culpable, but I don't think that label belongs in that violin. Moreover, it's presence doubled the price that he got.

[Brad Dorsey]

"How can that be? Xerox wasn't around when these fiddles were made."

You're right about this, of course. These labels were not photcopied -- they were reproduced by some sort of photo-engraving process that leaves the little dots. I'm not sure what the process is called, but it's the same method used to print photographs in newspapers.

Whatever the process is, and whatever it is called, I have seen a lot of these labels in Juzek violins (as well as several other types of labels). In addition to the little dots, these labels also have a shiny surface finish that reminds me of photcopied material. The bottom line is that I am sure this label was not put in this violin by this Ebay seller.

[pahdah_hound]

The extraneous dots are part of the halftone printing process where continuous tone images are are converted to dots of various sizes to simulate midtones. Dark areas have large dots and light areas have small dots. The paper towel texture is the result of rescreening or making a halftone from a halftone. The result is a moire pattern similar to those caused when looking through two window screens at the same time. The moire pattern prints as large evenly spaced areas of darker square shaped image-usually not black, but appearing grey.

If someone wanted to repreoduce a label prior to xerography, they could shoot a halftone of the label with a process camera and then make photographic prints-which explains the shiny surface. The problem occurs when the label being photographed was already a photograph and not an original. So, what we likely have here is a copy of a fake label-not even a copy of a real label.

Real Juzak labels are not hard to come by, and I would imagine a contemporary fake or forgery would contain a genuine label or at least an original copy of a genuine label.

Jesse

[andante]

Here's a label from another (apparently original) Juzek violin :

[Brad Dorsey]

The label you show seems to look the same in design and printing method as the one in the Ebay violin. As I said, I've seen a lot of them.

[pahdah_hound]

Here's another Juzek label that is a bit different.

Jesse

[raymanrmd123]

...buy something like this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...916852&rd=1

...copy the photos into something like photoshop; antique there them at your leisure...then use some old paper and a good quality color inkjet printer to print them out...if further "authenticity" is desired then brush on some wet potting soil, let them dry in the sun for a few days; brush off the dirt and use as needed.