Bow Tutorial

[fiddlecollector]

Hi Jeffrey so whats your views on this,any ideas?

I don`t know anything regarding this bow,except that its mine and the quality is really good,the grain runs perfectly straight,the finish is silky smooth,and its what i would call chocolate in colour.

It also is remarkably thin behind the head and the head is quite broad compared to the shaft.The stick is extremely strong also.

Thanks

http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrowse.asp?selected=175718

[Jeffrey Holmes]

Stud: Is Peccatte/Tourte you guess? Others agree? Read Benoit's website carefully and he'll pretty much tell you (about his model). Let the others know, OK?

Fiddlecollector: Check the photos that have been linked and please tell us what do you think!

[fiddlecollector]

Of the links you posted ,it resembles the first ouchard bow and also slightly the last link(the Lamy).

I`m not very good at all figuring bows out.So i`m probably completely wrong.

I`m concentrating on the curve at the top of the head and the rather gentle curve at going into the tip.

[Jeffrey Holmes]

Fiddlecollector;

I'd agree with you concerning the similarity to the design of the Ouchard head...

[fiddlecollector]

Thanks,who made their bows with a very silky,smooth finish,

probably unvarnished?

[Jeffrey Holmes]

... a good number of makers did. With a few exceptions, varnish (or lack of it) not a detail I'd use for primary ID. It's also a detail that can be altered (polish added.. varnish removed).

[fiddlecollector]

Where would you place this bow French? German?? English???

I was always under the impression it was mainly German makers who didn`t varnish the sticks.

[Jeffrey Holmes]

From the head alone I'd *guess* German...

Yes, there were German makers who finished sticks with an oil finish.. or left them "dry"; Pfretzschner was one (after he left Vuillaume's workshop and set up his workshop in Germany)... but I still would avoid using this detail as a primary factor in ID for the reasons stated above.

[Renaissanceman]

This looks like a very good bow. Nicely grained pernambuco. The head mortice seems unusually wide and would provide a nice ribbon of hair. Does the wood have a flamed appearance?

I would agree with Jeffery that this is most likely German, but usually the Germans would at least stamp Germany under the frog!! There were a lot of French bows that have no markings. Maybe you have one of these.

Please let us know how it plays once the bow is renovated.

[your_piano_stud]

Okay, here's what i see in Benoit's bow... i am a beginner this so don't laugh... First,i see a lot of Tourte in Pecatte in how the head tilts and the smooth severe cure from the top of the head to the tip. I think both Benoit and Pecatte follow this severe curve closely. If you compare the later Tourte pic you put up with the Roman nose, and compared that with the Pecatte Benoit copied, you see lots of similarties in the head. And if you compared the same Tourte pic with the typical Pecatte pic you put you, you see the same similarities. Like you said, Maline does take the pointiness to the extremem, so does Maire... But Maline and Maire's tapering from top of the head to the tip is much more gentle.

That pointy head is just STUNNING and GORGEOUS!

On the other hand, German bow typically has that early Tourte head where the top of the head is round rather than the pointy head. That makes the balance totally different. With that said, I hope everyone enjoyed Benoit's site, I've waited many years to see that!

[BJTong5]

I always wonder what makes the French bows so much more desirable and expensive than good German bows like the old Pfretzschner. Either the good German bows are under priced or the French bows are over priced. A lot of German bows tend to have too much wood in the middle of the stick and tend to make the feel a bit too heavy. What is your opinion about the value of German bows in the regard?

[fiddlecollector]

The stick isn`t flamed,the grain runs perfectly straight,from above in particular you can see the staight parallel grain lines,i personally don`t think its German ,just a gut feeling.The stick is extremely light but strong and still very flexible,it is also shorter than standard at 28 1/2 ". By thin i mean thin!! 3.5 mm looking from above at just behind the head.It is 8mm at the widest at the frog end and the stick is actually oval not round.

It tapers perfectly from this to the butt end .

There are no stamps at all apart from a very faint `VII` in front of the peg mortice,this is very faint and not the usual heavily marked numbers .

[Michael Darnton]

How about some shots of the frog??

[fiddlecollector]

Hi Michael ,the frog is unfortunately missing which is why i`ve never had it haired yet.It was in the case with an Albert Deblaye violin that i bought from a lady in France about two years ago,The other bow was a Lamy(real ,which i sold a few months later) and of normal size.The lady reckoned her father bought both bows around the same time as the violin (1920`s).Thats as much as she knew .

[Japes]

This might be of interest to a few of you.

[lversola]

Jeffrey, is there a good book on this subject? I know there's specialized books by Childs on the Peccatte family, but is there a definitive treatise on bow makers, their styles, and bow identification?

[Jeffrey Holmes]

... the Vatelot books (2 book set) cover the French makers pretty well. The new set by Millant and Raffin is very interesting... and contains more history. Both sets are rather pricy, however.

[Guy_Gallo]

Quote:

---

I put together a group of photos including (from top to bottom) the Stern Tourte, another later Tourte, a Tourte model by Dominique Peccatte (rare... I've only seen a few), a more typical Peccatte and a Simon. See what you think. Notice the “Roman nose” on the later Tourte... and Peccatte’s interpretation of it.

---

Since this thread answers some questionis posed in the Quartet of Bows thread, I thought I'd resurrect it.

Here is the image refered to in the above quotation:

[Guy_Gallo]

Here's a diagram (from the Retford Book "Bows and their Makers") that was previously part of this thread, now uploaded to the Maestronet server:

[Regis]

Thanks Guy.

It sure helps when we use the same terminology. What is the correct term for the front slope (above the point)? I've always called it the "front" but???

[Jeffrey Holmes]

Many refer to that area as the "nose".

[Regis]

Perhaps like so?

[lversola]

Wow -- I remember starting this thread in '03 back when I was hunting for a new stick, and I'm glad to see this one's been resurrected! However I've noticed that most of our bow tutorials have centered around the tip of the bow. What about the frog? Does anybody have a similar diagram that describes the different parts of the frog?

[T_Rocca]

Stud, you are from Boston too? I have a Rolland bow aswell. my and my friends together bought 3 of them